Ep 7: The Elephant in the Room

2024-06-19 00:36:07

Twelve-year-old McKay Everett disappeared from his Texas home in September 1995. His father Carl returned from an Amway meeting to find the back door ajar and the telephone ringing. On the line, a woman with a raspy voice demanded $500,000. Over the next week, the FBI played a game of cat-and-mouse with the kidnappers, who used inside information to stay one step ahead of the investigation. Ultimately the FBI uncovered a series of crimes that started long before McKay was taken. Most shocking of all was the suspect. McKay had been betrayed by someone he trusted – a pillar of the community hiding a dark secret. But decades later, McKay’s mother, Paulette, still isn’t satisfied with the official story. She doesn’t think everyone involved has been brought to justice. Ransom: Season 1 - Position of Trust is a story of greed and betrayal and how one’s outward appearance can be dangerously deceiving.

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Speaker 2
[00:00.00 - 00:07.80]

A warning about content. This episode includes discussions of sexual assault. Listener discretion is advised.

[00:12.44 - 00:23.52]

In the aftermath of McKay-Everett's murder, McKay's father, Carl, was devastated. Carl Everett has since passed away. But here's his friend, John Husbands.

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Speaker 1
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Lots of people could kill somebody to protect their child. But after the fact, for revenge, I think there's a lot of people that would do that.

[00:34.44 - 00:39.10]

Honestly, if you just approach yourself honestly. There's some people that would chicken out.

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Speaker 2
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There's some people that couldn't do it.

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Speaker 1
[00:40.48 - 00:41.70]

There's some people that could do it.

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And Carl wasn't chicken.

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Speaker 1
[00:44.04 - 00:57.88]

He had guns and knives and everything. It was almost ridiculous to have walked around armed for a while. I mean, knives. Who arms themselves with knives? He was messed up for a while.

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Speaker 2
[00:59.10 - 01:10.84]

On September 20th, 1995, a week after McKay had been killed, a grand jury in Montgomery County, Texas, indicted Hilton Crawford for capital murder.

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Speaker 1
[01:11.16 - 01:30.18]

I'll never forget. After Hilton was arraigned, Carl followed him back from the courthouse back to the jail. Carl called me and he said, I am following a police car and Hilton Crawford's in the back of it. And he said, I have my pistol pulled. And he said, I want to shoot him.

[01:30.60 - 01:48.78]

And I thought, well, I don't blame you. But I wanted to snuff him out. I make no bones about that. I wanted to hurt somebody. And I said, you know, Carl, as crazy a world as we live in, I said, they'd probably put you right in the cell that they're taking him to if you kill him.

[01:49.42 - 02:02.68]

I think he had his opportunity. I don't think he missed his opportunity. I think he had his opportunity and didn't take it. And I'm not sure he had ever been convicted in Montgomery County of murder either. But what kept Carl from killing him, I don't know.

[02:03.10 - 02:23.86]

I said, give the courts an opportunity to work. And so he did not pull the trigger, needless to say. But you go through all of those crazy feelings and they're normal. In abnormal circumstances, abnormal behaviors become normal.

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Speaker 2
[02:48.78 - 03:09.72]

As investigators and prosecutors worked to put together a capital case, the Everetts were left to pick up the pieces. They were glad that Hilton was sitting in jail. But the grief and anger were overwhelming. Hilton's actions had a fallout that lingered for decades, harming everyone involved.

[03:11.52 - 03:21.50]

As months passed, Paulette began to recover from her stroke. She slowly regained her movement and speech. But everything was difficult.

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Speaker 1
[03:21.90 - 03:38.00]

Our life became so abnormal with media and trial and the FBI. And after McKay's death, I would come home. And it was back when we had all those old-fashioned voice message machines. And I remember one day I had 70-something calls.

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Speaker 2
[03:38.06 - 03:40.24]

And I went, enough.

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Speaker 1
[03:40.72 - 03:50.00]

I can't return all these calls. I didn't try to be tough. I didn't try to be strong. I didn't fake it. I'm not good at faking it either, by the way.

[03:51.38 - 04:10.18]

And I was like, I don't care if my hair's not combed. I don't care if I don't have on makeup. Leave me alone. I don't care. So I always tell people, when somebody's going through a bunch of stuff, I don't care what the stuff is, do yourself a favor.

[04:11.04 - 04:12.06]

Shut up.

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Speaker 2
[04:13.38 - 04:20.18]

While Paulette did what she needed to cope, Carl stuffed down his feelings to try to keep it together.

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Speaker 1
[04:20.78 - 04:29.26]

Carl stuffed it. He stayed out of town, stayed gone. He didn't want to come home. He didn't want to be around me. He said, I can't stand to look at you.

[04:30.98 - 04:37.46]

He said that I looked too much like McKay. And I'm thinking, well, that's a fine how-do-you-do.

[04:40.54 - 04:55.44]

I could not change who I was. I could not change how I looked. I was McKay's mom. That right there was going to weigh on him forever. And he started not coming home for weeks at a time.

[04:55.58 - 05:14.02]

And then, if he came home, he'd come in the house, drop off the dirty clothes. He'd be there for just a little bit of time. And then he'd just start sobbing. And he'd go pack up clothes and leave. He later remarked, I was having to take my time in grief, which is true.

[05:14.30 - 05:20.28]

I don't fault him for that. We were under the most severe circumstances.

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Speaker 2
[05:24.28 - 05:38.54]

All of a sudden, Paulette found herself alone in a large, empty home. The FBI and her family had left. Carl was always out of the house. And, of course, McKay was gone.

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Speaker 1
[05:39.52 - 05:41.46]

It was so quiet, it was deafening.

[05:43.86 - 05:52.96]

There's no door slamming or the refrigerator being open 50 times a day, or I need some more cookies. That's gone.

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[05:53.88 - 05:59.78]

In that emptiness, Paulette found herself replaying everything about McKay's kidnapping.

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Speaker 1
[06:00.16 - 06:26.04]

You know, at night, when it's quiet, you do think on those things. And, to be honest, you dwell on them. And I've asked myself so many times, what in the world happened? It was just like, the FBI called it like a tornado in your life, a hurricane in your life. The counselors would say Hilton Crawford was a crocodile, cold-blooded.

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Speaker 2
[06:26.38 - 06:55.10]

But it wasn't just Hilton that Paulette found herself fixating on. There was something else about this case that, to this day, sends her mind spinning in the middle of the night. The part that still bothers Paulette is that she suspects Hilton's wife, Connie, was somehow involved. And the thought that her friend, who she'd taught with in school for years, had stabbed her in the back, that felt like so much more of a betrayal.

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Speaker 1
[06:56.00 - 07:11.96]

Connie's involved, and I knew it from the get-go. I knew it. And I started digging like a crazy woman on that. Just possessed, you know, because I just felt like, you know, don't overlook anything.

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Speaker 2
[07:12.60 - 07:21.30]

Paulette thought back to how Carl had called Connie the night of the kidnapping. But she'd said she didn't know how to get in contact with Hilton.

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[07:21.78 - 07:23.96]

If she covered for him, that makes her culpable.

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How Connie had left out key details when the FBI questioned her.

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[07:28.66 - 07:32.60]

She began to play the dumb wife immediately.

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[07:32.92 - 07:38.82]

And how Connie had never once visited her and Carl after McKay disappeared.

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Speaker 1
[07:39.40 - 07:45.24]

What friend didn't show up? Connie. Yeah, that's no friend.

[07:47.26 - 07:48.50]

That's no friend.

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Speaker 2
[07:48.50 - 08:17.36]

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[08:17.96 - 08:44.46]

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[08:44.46 - 08:47.22]

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[08:47.22 - 08:58.12]

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[09:02.82 - 09:13.20]

Hallette's suspicion of Connie began when she went to speak to Connie after Hilton's arrest. At the time, Connie was staying at her sister Anne-Marie Mizzou's house.

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Speaker 1
[09:13.20 - 09:27.62]

Connie's sister's driveway, Anne-Marie's driveway was real long. Connie saw us. She came running down the drive clutching a bed pillow, screaming at me, McKay's dead, McKay's dead. I know he's dead. Hilton hired a hitman.

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Speaker 2
[09:28.90 - 10:12.38]

Hallette wondered why Connie would scream that McKay was dead unless she had inside knowledge of the crime. She thinks that what Connie said would legally be considered an excited utterance, which is a statement made in response to a shocking event. In the eyes of the law, excited utterances are considered trustworthy, less likely to be lies, because someone is reacting without thinking. A couple of months later, the FBI interviewed Connie's sister, Anne-Marie Mizzou, about Hallette's visit. In a statement Mizzou wrote for the FBI, She said that Connie had wanted to reach out to the Everetts but had been advised against it.

[10:13.06 - 10:52.54]

She said that Connie ran down the driveway and she and Hallette hugged each other and cried. Mizzou said that Connie was, quote, hysterical. But Mizzou does verify that Connie did repeatedly scream that McKay was dead and also wondered out loud why Hilton hadn't just killed himself. However, Mizzou said that Connie had no inside knowledge of the crime. She says that Connie was assuming that McKay was dead because the FBI told her they'd found blood inside Hilton's trunk and they'd found Hilton's gun at the storage site in Lumberton.

[10:53.32 - 11:29.86]

Mizzou said that later that day, when Hilton told his sons that McKay was on a bus back from New Orleans, Connie held out hope that McKay was still alive and prayed hard for his safety. Mizzou says that when Connie went to visit Hilton in prison that night, shortly before he drew the map, that was the first time Hilton told her that McKay was dead. But Hallette wasn't just bothered by what Connie had said that day. She was bothered by what Connie was doing. Or rather, what she wasn't doing.

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Speaker 1
[11:29.86 - 11:43.26]

I was hunting rosary beads because when anything went wrong in Connie's life, she would say the rosary. Any other crisis in the world, it could be. the cat was dying, they'd have those rosary beads out.

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[11:43.60 - 11:47.30]

But Hallette didn't spot any rosary beads that day.

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Not a one.

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[11:49.02 - 12:07.94]

Hallette thinks Connie wasn't praying for McKay because Connie already knew he was dead. But when producer Ben Kebrick asked Cindy Rosenthal, the FBI agent who monitored Connie shortly after Hilton's arrest, she did recall seeing Connie praying with rosary beads.

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Speaker 1
[12:08.42 - 12:17.02]

I've heard some descriptions of her with like rosary beads. Oh yes, I do remember that now that you bring it up. She was, she was doing a lot of praying.

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Speaker 2
[12:17.78 - 12:37.08]

Agent Rosenthal said that she felt that Connie had been blindsided by Hilton's arrest. But then again, it's hard to tell. It's also very possible that her demeanor was just upset about him being caught. I really don't know. I took it at the time that she didn't know what was going on.

[12:37.88 - 13:21.84]

When it came to the kidnapping itself, Hallette thought it was suspicious that Connie didn't know Hilton's cell phone number. This was especially suspect given that Billy Allen told the FBI that Connie had given him Hilton's number the very next morning when Hilton was trying to get in touch with him to help dispose of the murder weapon. Connie has only spoken on the record once about this case, in a civil trial years after the fact. According to her deposition there, Connie had asked Hilton for his number after he got his cell phone, but he told her to just call his office if she needed to get in touch with him. Connie said Hilton kept a lot from her.

[13:21.84 - 13:47.00]

She said she knew there were problems with the security business Hilton had run with Petro, but she didn't know it had dissolved. Up until his arrest, Hilton led her to believe he owned the security guard company where he worked. And she says she didn't know the family was in debt, because Hilton had all the bills sent to his office. He told her it was easier that way.

[13:48.70 - 14:08.76]

Connie's story is complicated by the fact that she and Hilton filed for bankruptcy in May of 1995, and she signed legal documents regarding the bankruptcy. But Connie claims she didn't realize it was a personal bankruptcy, that Hilton had led her to believe it had something to do with the security business.

[14:11.16 - 14:24.82]

Paulette also found it suspicious that on the night McKay was abducted, the FBI asked Connie if she knew anyone who drove a golden-colored Chrysler. But Connie didn't bring up the fact that Hilton drove one.

[14:26.54 - 15:00.66]

Then again, her neighbors, the Schaffers, were in the room at the same time, and they also didn't bring up Hilton's car, even though they were familiar with it. John Schaffer remarked about this at Hilton's trial, saying that he and his wife later discussed how the suspect's vehicle matched Hilton's car. It seems that, to the Schaffers and Connie, the thought that Hilton could have been involved in the kidnapping never even crossed their mind. It's like Hilton's friend Sam Petro said in the last episode.

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Speaker 1
[15:01.00 - 15:09.02]

You don't want to believe you've been friends with a killer. That's not something that you want. penetrating your mind. You just don't.

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[15:10.00 - 15:18.44]

Petro thinks that Connie may have been in denial about who Hilton really was, but he doesn't think she was involved in any way.

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Speaker 1
[15:18.84 - 15:39.92]

I don't think Connie would ever do anything nefarious in any way. Connie is probably the straightest person I've ever known. She was very sheltered. She was very, very sheltered. She lived in a cocoon, and Hilton did not let any of his outside issues impose on the family.

[15:40.18 - 15:41.52]

He was very careful about.

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Speaker 2
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that. Petro thinks that Paulette's grief may have distorted how she saw Connie.

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Speaker 1
[15:47.86 - 15:57.72]

I think Paulette may have been misreading. Connie. I have six kids. If anything like that ever happened to any of my kids, there's no telling where I would be mentally.

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[15:58.32 - 16:11.28]

But Paulette was far from the only one to suspect Connie's involvement. To many, like Paulette's neighbors, the Khans, whether Connie was involved was just a natural question to ask.

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Speaker 1
[16:11.82 - 16:30.06]

I mean, they were married. So then, you know, your mind starts going to, and you think, okay, so, did she have something to do with this, too? Or did she know? I mean, how could you not know that, you know, some of this is going on? So, you know, you started doubting things as well.

[16:30.72 - 16:38.38]

And I knew Connie, and, being a sweet person, I don't know that the way she was or whatever, that she could have been involved in something.

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[16:38.38 - 16:43.88]

like that. And you hoped not. Nancy Khan thought back to the.

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[16:43.88 - 17:00.68]

morning after McKay disappeared. Connie Crawford called and asked what was going on. And sometimes I think, okay, were you just fishing for information from me to, you know, to pass on to him? And I don't know. You know, I just hoped not.

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Speaker 2
[17:02.24 - 17:24.62]

Micah Duddle, the assistant district attorney who prosecuted the case, says investigators were very interested in Connie as well. We investigated Mrs. Crawford extensively. Remember, a Duddle had brought San Petro before the jury to ask him about Connie, the stolen jewelry, and the insurance fraud.

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Speaker 1
[17:24.62 - 17:36.32]

Did Connie ever talk about her jewelry being lost? Yes, she did. I was pushing like a maniac to get her arrested. But ultimately, the D.A. didn't press charges.

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Speaker 2
[17:36.32 - 17:57.38]

against Connie regarding McKay's abduction or any other crimes. She was never indicted. So that tells you what we thought. We just didn't have enough evidence, probable cause, to indict her. And let me tell you, if there had been just a little bit more evidence, I would have indicted her.

[17:58.32 - 18:00.62]

But didn't have it, so we didn't do it.

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[18:27.40 - 18:54.24]

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[18:54.70 - 19:10.56]

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[19:10.56 - 19:11.56]

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The effects of McKay's murder on the Everetts and the Crawfords have persisted for decades. It's the sort of grief that one never gets over. Paulette says she's felt pressured over the years to forgive Hilton and his family.

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[19:33.40 - 19:38.12]

You know, I'd love to say I think they're feeling spotless, but I don't.

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Paulette thinks it's important to learn from tragedies like McKay's, to dig into what actually happened, even if it's uncomfortable.

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[19:48.56 - 19:55.08]

The elephant has to be talked about. The elephant has to be discussed, or somebody else will suffer.

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To Paulette, the elephant in the room was Hilton's gambling problem.

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Speaker 1
[20:00.42 - 20:16.74]

When there's an elephant in the room and you just walk around it and never say anything, sooner or later something's going to happen, especially with addictions, you know, because they don't get better on their own. You've got to work at getting better and face it.

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[20:17.72 - 20:25.82]

And Paulette thinks that Hilton's family and friends are at least partially responsible for ignoring Hilton's gambling addiction.

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Speaker 1
[20:26.30 - 20:41.48]

A series of decisions cost McKay's death, not one. A series of decisions by several people. You can't undo this, but there's no need to treat it like the cat litter box. You can cover it up, but it's still there.

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Speaker 2
[20:42.26 - 20:50.26]

Paulette says that this type of denial is common, that all sorts of inappropriate behavior gets ignored within families.

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Speaker 1
[20:50.26 - 21:11.92]

How many people have an uncle, whoever, who goes after the kiddos? If people just ignore it or try to stuff it under the rug, then it goes from hugging too close to fondling to on and on. You have to talk about. this is not appropriate. You have to do that.

[21:12.06 - 21:12.88]

It's not easy.

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[21:13.84 - 21:23.02]

And to Paulette, this issue is very personal. She knows firsthand how hard it can be to address uncomfortable topics within a family.

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[21:23.62 - 21:38.26]

My biggest recollection of my family years, I would stuff my siblings in a closet and I'd peek out the closet door and my mother would be trying to fight my dad. He was trying to get to us kids.

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[21:39.02 - 21:47.96]

It took her decades before she spoke up about how her father had sexually abused her and physically abused her siblings.

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Speaker 1
[21:49.08 - 21:59.00]

You know, I couldn't confront my father. He was already dead. My mother said, why would you come forward at this time? And I told her, I said, I will not go silently crazy to keep you comfortable.

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[21:59.70 - 22:09.84]

Paulette felt her mother swept her father's abuse under the rug. She was more interested in keeping up appearances than keeping her children safe.

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Speaker 1
[22:10.02 - 22:22.46]

She just didn't want to face it. Yeah, let me play dumb. Let me ignore it. Let me pretend it's not there, even though I know it is. If you met him in public, you would have thought, what a lovely man.

[22:23.24 - 22:28.58]

And then you get home and he's a maniac. I never trusted my mother.

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[22:30.50 - 23:09.60]

And Paulette sees parallels between her mother and father and Connie and Hilton. Paulette says even if Connie was completely in the dark about the kidnapping, Paulette believes she must have known that Hilton had a gambling problem and she should have gotten him help. But it's unclear how aware Connie was of Hilton's problems. Sam Petro told us that Hilton kept his gambling and financial problems hidden from his family. In fact, gambling addiction is known as the hidden addiction because, unlike drug addictions, it has no visible symptoms.

[23:10.88 - 23:27.74]

For Paulette, the time right after McKay's death was the hardest in her life. She felt like her whole life had been turned upside down. But it seemed to her that Connie was just continuing forward as if nothing had happened.

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Speaker 1
[23:28.84 - 23:55.92]

She had two seagull palms in her front yard. And she took such care of those things, it was ridiculous. And I mean, I like plants too. But I thought, if my husband had just murdered a child, I wouldn't have sense enough to get out there and worry about two seagull palms and cover them up in winter. I would be a blithering idiot if my husband had murdered a child.

[23:56.20 - 23:57.00]

Not her.

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[23:57.74 - 24:01.88]

The seeming normalcy of Connie's life bothered Paulette.

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[24:02.08 - 24:04.64]

She was out there covering those seagull palms up.

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[24:05.68 - 24:11.16]

So, deep in grief, Paulette decided to take out her anger on the seagull palms.

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Speaker 1
[24:11.54 - 24:19.12]

I poured salt on those things. I poured antifreeze. And I thought, well, that's better to kill them than her.

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[24:19.82 - 24:40.82]

The seagull palms weren't Paulette's only target. Rick Metz, the family friend who had originally been accused of abducting McKay, says that during this period, Paulette couldn't drive because of her stroke. So he would often give Paulette rides. Paulette called me and says, can you come drive me somewhere? I said, sure.

[24:41.24 - 24:44.22]

And she had a paper bag. I'm like, where are we going?

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Speaker 1
[24:44.46 - 24:56.20]

And she just drives me by their house. Well, their house, I knew what she was talking about. She put like 20 pounds of mustard green seeds all in their yard. Comes up as weeds. You can't get rid of them.

[24:57.92 - 25:13.12]

And I thought, Paulette, don't get us caught. She goes, I'm not messing nothing up. Another time I took her and she threw water balloons filled with red paint over the fence into their swimming pool. I mean, she was grieving.

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Speaker 2
[25:13.92 - 25:40.82]

The way Paulette and Rick described this garden sabotage, it might sound spiteful and vindictive, but harmless enough. But the harassment that the Crawfords received wasn't harmless. A source close to the Crawfords told us this period was terrifying for them. Everyone connected to Hilton became a pariah within the community. But Connie, most of all.

[25:41.38 - 25:49.96]

Once someone scattered nails on her sister's driveway. Another time someone shot a bullet through Connie's window while she was home.

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Speaker 1
[25:50.76 - 26:01.38]

People were angry. It wasn't just me. There were people all over this county angry about the disgrace of what happened.

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[26:03.34 - 26:06.14]

Here's Paulette's neighbor, Nancy Kahn.

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Speaker 1
[26:06.14 - 26:29.74]

People didn't want to be around them or they didn't like even, you know, at church. You know, how could you be married to someone like that? Or it was probably a, you know, very, very difficult time for her as well. I don't know her feelings or her thoughts and all that. But I do know that people in the town did kind of draw away from them.

[26:29.74 - 26:32.82]

Because you wonder who was involved in this.

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Speaker 2
[26:33.80 - 26:48.44]

Connie Crawford has never spoken publicly about McKay's abduction. She didn't respond to phone calls or letters we sent regarding this podcast, which makes reporting on this story difficult.

[26:50.54 - 27:16.00]

In journalism, there's a concept called access bias. Essentially, it's a tendency to tell stories that favor the view of sources that journalists have easy access to. Working on this story, we interviewed Paulette for hours. She connected us with other people to interview and responded to fact-checking questions. We thought it was important to give Connie a chance to tell her side of the story.

[27:16.20 - 27:22.06]

So our producer, Ben Kebrick, tracked down Connie to see if he could convince her to talk in person.

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Speaker 1
[27:23.04 - 27:33.42]

All right, I'm down the street from Connie's place. So I'm gonna go by and see what happens and hope for the best.

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Speaker 2
[27:35.70 - 27:43.38]

We weren't sure if Connie had received our messages and was ignoring them, or if we even had the correct address.

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Speaker 1
[27:46.28 - 27:49.18]

Hey. Hi, I was looking for Connie Crawford.

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Speaker 2
[27:49.62 - 27:51.90]

What? I was looking for Connie Crawford.

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Speaker 1
[27:52.04 - 27:59.08]

Yes, this is me. Hi, so I was looking for Connie, who is the ex-wife of Hilton Crawford.

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Speaker 2
[27:59.78 - 28:16.10]

Yeah, uh-huh. So I'm working on a project that's looking back at that case. Connie changed her name after all. these events took place, and she agreed to let us record as long as we didn't use her new name on our podcast.

[28:20.64 - 28:29.78]

Connie was cautious. She didn't invite Ben inside, but asked to speak in her garage, away from the eyes of nosy neighbors.

1
Speaker 1
[28:30.76 - 28:50.00]

The story normally ends with the arrest or the trial or something like that, but I feel like there are all these wider consequences, that it wasn't just Hilton, it was the whole family and the whole community. Well, you do know how he was killed. I'll tell you what, I was relieved.

2
Speaker 2
[28:50.00 - 29:04.06]

We'll talk about how Hilton was killed later in this podcast, but we thought it was telling that Connie felt relieved by his death. Connie brought up the harassment that she'd received after Hilton's arrest.

1
Speaker 1
[29:04.14 - 29:19.78]

I just don't want anybody to come after me again. My sister wanted me to leave, and I said, no, I didn't do anything. I'm gonna stay right here. They put horrible signs up in my yard. You experienced a very extreme version of the situation?

[29:19.78 - 29:26.58]

Yeah, I almost had a nervous breakdown. I can't tell you how many hospitals I was in.

[29:28.74 - 29:42.52]

Nobody knew the hospital, but one person, one of my friends, he was the only one that could call me, nobody else did. They were scared of me. They were scared that somebody would come over to me.

?
Unknown Speaker
[29:43.22 - 29:44.16]

Go ahead.

2
Speaker 2
[29:45.44 - 30:23.86]

Unfortunately, a neighbor turned on a leaf blower during our brief interview with Connie, but Connie said that because of incidents like someone shooting through her window, she feared for her life. Things got so bad, she ended up getting institutionalized in a psychiatric hospital, and the family kept where she was hospitalized, secret from friends because they didn't know who to trust. And now she feared that our podcast would set things off again, trigger a new wave of harassment against her and her family. I just wish you wouldn't talk to me anymore about it, okay?

1
Speaker 1
[30:24.36 - 30:43.70]

Appreciate you. speaking to me a little bit, and just to finish that one thought, I think you, like the harassment and stuff you experienced was very extreme, but I think there are other people that experience a similar thing, and I don't think that we normally talk about, you know,

2
Speaker 2
[30:43.76 - 30:52.50]

being a relative of someone who commits a crime like that, and I don't want to put you through unnecessary pain, but.

1
Speaker 1
[30:52.50 - 30:55.34]

No, I don't want you to come over here, no more.

2
Speaker 2
[30:55.52 - 31:07.40]

Yeah, but I do think there are people that might benefit from hearing your story because they've experienced something similar, or they will one day experience something similar.

1
Speaker 1
[31:07.60 - 31:11.30]

I hope to God they don't. Yeah. It's the worst day of my life.

?
Unknown Speaker
[31:11.74 - 31:12.08]

Yeah.

1
Speaker 1
[31:12.68 - 31:14.52]

For days. Yeah.

[31:16.26 - 31:18.34]

Nobody else has to go through that.

?
Unknown Speaker
[31:19.20 - 31:20.04]

Yeah, okay.

1
Speaker 1
[31:20.04 - 31:24.56]

Sir, I appreciate what you're doing, but just do it on your own. Yeah. Okay?

?
Unknown Speaker
[31:24.90 - 31:25.32]

All right.

2
Speaker 2
[31:25.80 - 31:26.82]

Thank you. I appreciate it.

1
Speaker 1
[31:26.94 - 31:27.98]

Have a good rest of your weekend.

2
Speaker 2
[31:33.70 - 32:00.36]

Obviously, we wanted to ask Connie a lot more. We wanted to give her a chance to respond to Paulette's accusations. We'll never really know if Connie was somehow involved. What we do know is that the district attorney's office investigated her and decided against prosecuting her. But despite this, Connie and her family faced severe harassment within the community.

[32:02.12 - 32:30.72]

We also were hoping to ask Connie more about Hilton and any red flags she might have noticed throughout their relationship. We can get some insights into Connie's perspective, though, from Tani Shannon, the author who interviewed Hilton in prison. Tani says that after Hilton's arrest, Connie bought into Hilton's stories about R.L. Remington and how Hilton had never intended to hurt McKay.

1
Speaker 1
[32:31.22 - 32:42.54]

Up until the trial, they spoke almost every day. He maintained that he had kind of been duped into this. And that was the story that he stuck to.

2
Speaker 2
[32:42.86 - 32:57.18]

And it appears that Connie's idealized image of Hilton didn't shatter all at once. As long as he was the only one in her ear, he could maintain the persona he'd cultivated for so many years.

1
Speaker 1
[32:57.18 - 33:03.00]

They talked frequently until the trial. And after the trial, she never spoke to him again.

2
Speaker 2
[33:03.40 - 33:11.78]

Because Tani says what came out at the trial was too much for Connie. Despite whatever caused him to do this,

1
Speaker 1
[33:11.82 - 33:17.38]

it was just something that was beyond her, beyond her ability to forgive.

2
Speaker 2
[33:20.00 - 33:22.10]

Next time on Ransom.

1
Speaker 1
[33:22.42 - 33:28.46]

What did Hilton Crawford ask you to do? He said he was going to pay me $5,000 to kill Sam Petro.

2
Speaker 2
[33:28.80 - 33:34.28]

He had it planned. And that's what makes this case so horrendous.

[33:55.30 - 34:21.52]

You should also know that help is available 24-7 if you or someone close to you has experienced rape or any other form of sexual abuse. In the United States, you can go to RAINN.org. That's the Rape, Abuse, Incest, and National Network website. at RAINN.org. You can also call 800-656-HOPE to connect with free resources.

[34:22.82 - 34:31.34]

For more information, including pictures, find us on social at The Ransom Podcast or visit our website, RansomPodcast.

[34:31.34 - 34:50.70]

com. We'll have new episodes every Wednesday and bonus episodes every Friday. Follow us now wherever you get your podcasts. And if you could leave a rating and review, we would really appreciate it. Ransom is researched and written by Ben Kebrick and hosted by me, Art Rascone.

[34:51.34 - 35:21.06]

Production and sound design by Ben Kebrick, Aaron Mason, and Trent Sell, who also did the mixing. Special thanks to Andrea Smartin, Kellyanne Halverson, Ryan Meeks, Amy Donaldson, Felix Bunnell, Josh Tilton, and Dave Cauley. Main musical score composed by Allison Leighton Brown, co-created by Austin Miller. For Podcast One, Executive Producer Eli Dvorkin. For Workhouse Media, Executive Producer Paul Anderson.

[35:21.86 - 35:32.62]

And for KSL Podcast, Executive Producer Cheryl Worsley. Ransom is produced by KSL Podcasts in association with Podcast One and Workhouse Media.

[35:42.22 - 35:42.86]

Hi,

[35:46.14 - 35:56.70]

everyone. This is Jillian with Court Junkie. Court Junkie is a true crime podcast that covers court cases and criminal trials, using audio clips and interviews with people close to the cases.

1
Speaker 1
[35:57.20 - 36:01.22]

Court Junkie is available on Apple Podcasts and PodcastOne.

[36:01.22 - 36:02.00]

com.

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