Flightless Bird: Hot Dogs
2023-12-19 00:43:40
Hi, I’m Dax Shepard, and I love talking to people. I am endlessly fascinated by the messiness of being human, and I find people who are vulnerable and honest about their struggles and shortcomings to be incredibly sexy. I invite you to join me as I explore other people’s stories. We will celebrate, above all, the challenges and setbacks that ultimately lead to growth and betterment. What qualifies me for such an endeavor? More than a decade of sobriety, a degree in Anthropology and four years of improv training. I will attempt to discover human “truths” without any laboratory work, clinical trials or data collection. I will be, in the great tradition of 16th-century scientists, an Armchair Expert.
Hi, it's David here. This is just a quick note before we start the episode. I wanted
to let you know that Flightless Bird is taking a little break after this episode, returning
in February next year. February the 6th to be exact. I wanted to say a big thanks for
listening this year. I get a lot of feedback through email and DMs, and while I can't get
back to all of you, it's always really great to hear your point of view on the episodes
that have just gone out, and your ideas for future episodes. I love hearing from you,
and I really can't wait to get stuck in again next year. You're about to listen to episode
71 of Flightless Bird, so maybe while we're on a break you can go back and revisit some
of the old ones. I think episode 1 about religion is really fun. So is episode 11 about circumcision.
Episode 20, we did porn, and that goes places. Or there's maths, or toilets, or Waffle House,
or Waco. I also wanted to give a big thanks to everyone who works on this show. Rob, our producer,
editors Billy and Jake, and Jake and Matt who score every episode. It's a really tiny team,
and I sort of can't believe we get this thing out every week, so thanks to them. And of course,
a big thanks to Monica, who I get to hang out with every week, and Dax, who gives us the space to do
our own thing. I really love discovering America with my little team, and most importantly with you,
who listens to this show. Thanks, and have a happy holiday. I'm David Farrier, and New Zealand are
accidentally marooned in America, and I want to figure out what makes this country tick. Now,
the obvious answer to this question is, of course, food. Food makes America tick,
because without food, there'd be no Americans. But it's the food that America chooses to consume
that's fascinating to me, and consume it to a level that boggles the mind. With 62 hot dogs
and buns in 10 minutes, for his 16th win, I give you the number one ranked eater in the world,
Joey Chestnut!
That clip was from ESPN, who covered an American man named Joey Chestnut winning his 16th Nathan's
Hot Dog Eating Contest. 62 hot dogs downed in 10 minutes. It's extreme, but then the average
American doesn't feel that far behind, because Americans eat 20 billion hot dogs each year.
Average that out, and the average American eats 70 hot dogs each year. So, grab that wiener and
bun and prepare to cover it in mustard, ketchup, onions, relish and cheese and all sorts of stuff,
because this is the Hot Dogs Episode.
Flightless, flightless, flightless bird, touchdown in America. I'm a flightless bird, touchdown in America.
How's it going, Monica?
Well, I'm grateful we're doing this episode, because I do think hot dogs are extremely
American.
They're so American.
Did you have them in New Zealand?
Yeah, we have hot dogs. If you order a hot dog in New Zealand, you'll get a wiener on a stick,
which here is a corn dog. So that gets confusing. But yeah, we definitely have them, but they're
not as much in our culture as they are here. I guess the equivalent to the American hot dog would
be the mince pie, which I bought you on a while ago. That felt kind of like unhealthy, delicious
thing that we eat.
I do love a hot dog. My mom loves hot dogs.
Oh, yeah.
So I associate hot dogs a lot with my mother.
Yeah, you'd grow up and have hot dogs on weekends and stuff.
Yeah, but also we had the Processed, the brand that I won't say so we don't get in trouble,
but has a fun rhyme song to it.
I can't stop reading about hot dogs. And so that was that brand. There's the Wienermobile,
which is a fleet of motor vehicles shaped like a hot dog on a bun.
And they've been around since 1936.
Wow. Yeah, they're a big-
They're like the thing.
They're the thing. And we would have those hot dogs constantly. My mom would just, I guess,
like boil them or microwave them. We would just eat them all the time. The classic,
you cut up hot dogs and eat with ketchup. I had that meal so often growing up.
Do you still today, having eaten so many hot dogs in your life already, do you still enjoy them?
Are you ever drawn to the hot dog? Or are you like, I'm done with that now?
I am drawn, but if I'm at a cookout, I normally am choosing the burger over the hot dog.
Yeah, right. Yeah.
But if I am at a sporting event, like a baseball game specifically, gotta have the hot dog.
I think I had one with you, Rob, right? We had a hot dog at a
game a while ago, and they're pretty nasty. They're a very basic, soggy dog, aren't they?
I wouldn't say soggy.
I felt like the hot dog, the sausage bit was like,
I felt like it had just definitely come out of the water. I felt wet.
At the baseball game?
At the game. I felt wet. I just remember eating this dog and thinking it feels damp.
I feel like hot dogs are very specific at baseball games. I'm like, maybe you'll get a stale bun.
I don't feel at all like the hot dog at a baseball game is wet.
I had one wet, bad dog.
Schnauzer.
It was raining that day, so maybe.
Maybe it was. Yeah, maybe it just got rained on.
It just got rained on. This is slightly on a tangent and probably wildly out of date by
the time we release this, but I came across a funny thing during the rounds where Uber Eats
is generating AI-generated food, and the food images, like instead of getting stock images
of a pizza, they're getting AI to do it. And because it's AI, it's kind of messing up.
And so these foods are popping up as ads on Uber Eats, and they're all a bit warped
and a bit wrong. So there'll be like a pizza, but it looks like it's off.
Oh, weird.
It looks like a dessert. So the AI is kind of messing it up.
Weird.
Anyway, that's some new food news.
Well, I'm really excited to hear about your adventures. So you and Rob went out eating
hot dogs. I'm a little, okay, like what the fuck?
It was a boys trip. Sometimes boys just need to be boys. We were out there talking about baes.
Excuse me.
You had to eat those wieners.
You had to eat wieners. We had to man stuff, you know?
2023, and you are not to do that. Like really. So that's not a good excuse.
It was disgusting. So yeah, this is our journey into the world of the hot dog.
Ladies and gentlemen, introducing the chocolate starfish and the hot dog flavored water.
Look, I'm sorry to do that to you, but early on in researching hot dogs, I was reminded of
90s new metal band Limp Bizkit and their seminal album, Chocolate Starfish and the Hot Dog Flavored
Water. The reference to the hot dog flavored water was apparently a nod to Crystal Geyser
bottled water, which the band joked tasted like meaty hot dogs. Ding, ding,
ding to the bottled water episode of Flightless Bird.
For this episode, it seemed like a good idea to just go experience some hot dogs,
as in a bun, the wiener, sauce, the mustard, all the stuff.
Now in New Zealand, if you order a hot dog, you're likely to get a fried sausage on a stick,
which in America, I think you call a corn dog. Ding, ding, ding to the Disney episode.
So on a warm, sluggish LA day, Rob picked me up and he grimaced with a slight level
of disgust, but also intrigue, as I suggested we go to Pink's.
Pink's is a Hollywood landmark. Started by Paul and Betty Pink in 1939,
today it serves about 2,000 hot dogs a day. It's not a place for hardcore foodies,
but Rob was in a kind mood and said yes. And so 15 minutes later, we pulled up outside Pink's,
which as the name suggests, is very pink. What are your initial thoughts on Pink's?
Describe this place in Los Angeles. All I really know about it is it's
famous for their hot dogs. There's always a big line.
The line today is mild, and we look at our options. There are a lot of dogs here.
Classic stretch chili dog, the Brando dog, bacon chili cheese dog, Polish pastrami dog.
This feels like it's all about the filling almost. It's almost what goes in is important,
because these are huge. Yeah, I'm a little overwhelmed
Good, they've got a Chicago Polish sausage. Hello, they got a Lord of the Rings. That's
right up my alley. Is that what you're gonna get?
I think I might have to. It looks like it's covered in onion rings.
My stomach hurts a little bit already from looking at these photos though.
I get the Lord of the Rings dog, and Rob gets the bacon chili cheese dog. No tomatoes.
Can I get no tomatoes on that? On the side, we get some onion rings
and some bacon nachos with cheese, and some cream sodas. Good Lord, heart attack coming up.
We walk to our tables out the back, passing an assortment of signed celeb photos on the wall.
American celebs who have attended Pink's.
Mario Lopez, got Jimmy Kimmel.
Bill Hader. Jamie Lee Curtis.
It's always nice to know you're dining where one day, years ago, possibly decades ago,
a famous person also dined.
They were in this room we're standing in right now, David.
I noticed Pink's is also selling merchandise,
another very American thing that fast food chains seem to do here.
And speaking of American, are hot dogs American?
Well, the wieners you find in the hot dog originally came from Germany,
but America took to them with gusto, and the hot dog became a go-to for America's working class.
It's rumoured the bun element was added in 1901 in New York,
when a vendor ran out of paper to hold the sausages in.
According to Wikipedia, which should not be the source of all knowledge,
but it's also very, very handy,
hot dogs are now a traditional element of American food culture,
having obtained significant cultural and patriotic status
from their association with public events and sports since the 1920s.
And today, as I look around Pink's,
it's sort of nice seeing everyone enjoying the same thing, hot dogs.
There are couples here, and tourists, and parents with their kids, and me and Rob.
I go and talk to Anthony, who's just sitting alone, but looks utterly satisfied.
Just them and their dog.
What do you like about Pink's? What do you like about this place?
Oh, I've been coming to Pink's since about 1969, since I was young.
But if anyone asks, I'm only 32.
Who brought you here? What was your first experience like at Pink's?
Do you remember?
I think I came with one of my girlfriends back then.
I was pretty young, and we came here, and I brought her out to eat.
And I've been coming here ever since.
What makes their hot dogs good?
They make their hot dogs special for them.
You know, you go to the market,
you get those skinny little hot dogs that don't taste very good.
These are really good.
What is it about the hot dog that makes it such an American meal?
Gee, I don't know.
You know, every time you go to a baseball game,
they don't serve hamburgers, they serve hot dogs, you know?
I guess it's the American favorite.
I wander over to another table.
There's a couple in their mid-thirties,
Paige and Spencer.
And they brought their dad, Greg, out for a hot dog.
Well, I've actually never been here,
and it's been about 10 years since I've lived in LA.
So I figured, I gotta do it, you know?
I gotta try it out.
So this is your first trip here?
This is my first trip, yeah.
Look, you've got a beautiful hot dog in front of you.
Can you sort of describe what you've ordered
and what's sitting in front of you there?
So I got the Brando,
which is a nine-inch stretch hot dog
with mustard, chili, onions, and cheddar cheese.
And I'll let you know how it is right now.
He's biting into it.
It's a big hot dog.
It's layered in chili, cheese.
It's intense.
You got it in there.
How are you feeling?
I feel complete now.
I feel like I...
Those sirens are for you.
I know, these sirens are for me.
Victory sirens.
It is a very American kind of pastime.
I honestly couldn't tell you where it was actually invented.
It's also super easy and a lot you can do with it,
as there's like so many different types here.
So it's kind of fun.
What would you say?
I think it's simple,
and it's something we could call ours, you know?
The pizza, we can't say that.
I don't know, the hamburgers from Hamburg.
Although we call it ours.
But yeah, I think we just...
We love it.
Just quickly, you've got a much healthier dog.
You've sort of almost got some vegetables on here.
What's going on?
Well, I was going to get exactly what my girlfriend got,
and then I figured I'd get something else,
which is the Chicago dog,
which they say drag it through the garden.
It's got all sorts of like the tomato,
and usually it's pickled.
This is a little different.
But yeah, I said that way we could share.
And then she said, oh, I'm not sharing.
I don't share my hot dog.
We've been together for six years.
I didn't know that.
This is my dad.
He's visiting.
What do you think of your hot dog here?
It looks like there's been a few bites you've taken.
What do you think?
Delicious.
Best one I've had today.
I see our hot dogs have just been delivered to our table.
So rush back to see Rob.
I'm hungry.
And these hot dogs are stacked.
It's more condiments than hot dog.
There's almost so much on these that they almost,
you know, it's going to just be a disgusting mess to eat.
But there's no way to get your mouth around this, right?
No, it's like full appetizer on a hot dog.
Yeah, I've just got onion rings and sauce stacked all over mine.
You've got a lot of bacon, a lot of chili,
a lot of real nasty cheese.
Yeah, unmelted crap cheese.
I mean, the cheese is kind of overpowering everything
that's all I'm tasting.
It's a hot dog.
It's good.
Oh, and the sides.
My God, the sides.
I mean, can you describe what is sitting here?
You got this as like a side, essentially.
What the fuck is this?
French fries with four pounds of cheese.
It looks like melted on top, like nacho cheese
and a ton of bacon crumbled all over it.
Americans do love cheese.
Like cheese has come into a few of these episodes now.
It's a popular thing here.
I mean, cheese is great.
You should do an episode about cheese in Wisconsin
next time you're in the Midwest.
Upcoming episode alert.
Cheeseheads.
Eventually, me and Rob are done.
We're at capacity.
We're wrecked.
We're full.
Full of bread and sausage and cheese and onions and bacon
and God knows what else.
Just like many things in America, everything's delicious.
But I am worried that it is slowly taking days
and weeks and months off my life.
You get that feeling, right?
Yeah, I feel like we're dying a week earlier
after this meal, for sure.
At least.
And you know what?
Today, it feels like a price worth paying.
It was really delicious.
Would you go back to Pink's, Rob?
Or just once in your life?
I want to go.
I've never been and it's been on my list.
It's a LA institution.
I'll go back there with you.
Rob's out.
He's done.
He's two.
I think once was enough.
It's the foodie and I'm talking.
A couple of things.
Yeah.
I came across a video on YouTube called How It's Made Hot Dogs.
Oh, yeah.
And I suggest you Google that at home and watch it.
I'm just going to play it for you, Monica.
Just a little bit of it.
The mechanics of hot dog making.
To create a homogenous mixture,
the ingredients are combined in a large mixing tank.
This mixture is then loaded into a sausage stuff,
which creates a continuous stream.
I mean, this is how all sausage is made, by the way.
Yeah, you forget sometimes about it's sort of a slurry.
It is.
Almost.
It's nasty.
It's nasty.
The wiener, the sausage, it's really nasty stuff.
I know, but it tastes so good.
Well, you know what, Monica?
What, David?
I've been recording a Costco episode for a while.
And just before I got here, I met up with your friend, Andy.
Andy Rosen.
Our friend Andy now, who is a big Costco enthusiast.
Yes, he is.
He took me for my first Costco experience, which will be an upcoming episode.
I can't wait for that.
But of course, Costco, I learned, has the cafeteria and the $1.50 hot dog.
People are obsessed with it.
They're obsessed.
I had it.
And?
Well, I bought some in for you.
You did?
Yeah, so I'm just going to abandon my mic.
That's really nice.
Thank you.
I thought it's crazy to do a hot dog episode without letting you have a hot dog.
I really am grateful.
And we had just had Jersey Mike's, but I am still excited.
Oh, wow.
Do we have condiments?
Oh, look at you.
Okay, this is controversial.
What do you put on your hot dog?
Do we get into this?
This is the question.
No, we can get into it now.
Okay.
I want to know.
So I will say that Costco dog has been sitting in the car for about three hours now.
Oh, this is so good.
But look, I just wanted you to have a hot dog in your hand.
I appreciate it.
I'm going to take a bite of it.
I'm going to take a photo of you while you've got that dog there.
Okay, this will be a controversial photo because I'm choosing.
You've got the ketchup.
Ketchup.
You've got the Heinz.
I'm a mustard Heinz combo.
Wait, you mean you like both?
I like both.
I'll put the mustard and the tomato sauce on.
I might do both.
But I used to, as a kid, I would only do ketchup.
I was like, ew, mustard.
The older you get though, you realize it's childish to like mustard.
I mean, I'm sorry, ketchup.
I just like ketchup.
Alison Roman would be mad at me for putting.
She will be mad at me for putting.
I feel like this is like a hot dog can be a happy place.
You can be a child and you can just live your best life.
You know, that's probably been in my fridge for a while.
Is it old?
No, it's not old.
It's not bad since used by.
It's fine.
Yeah, it'll be all right.
Yeah, it's good.
It is past.
No, is it?
But only barely.
By how much?
This is past by a month.
Oh, it's all right.
It's fine.
Yeah, it'll be all right.
I think it's fine.
It's all, it's all.
It's refrigerated.
Yeah.
It'll have a lot of chemicals in there.
Exactly.
Yeah.
All right, here we go.
I'm just going to have a little bite of the hot dog.
How is it?
It's really good.
It's good, right?
Yeah, dog's really good.
So it's $1.50 at Costco for one of these things.
I feel like it's an all beef hot dog.
It's all beef.
Yeah.
Which is good.
I think so.
I just Googled the whole Costco $1.50 phenomenon.
When longtime Costco president W. Craig Jelinek once complained to Costco co-founder
and former CEO Jim that their monolithic warehouse business was losing money on their
famously cheap $1.50 hot dog and soda package, Senegal enlistened, nodded, and then did his
best to make his take on the situation perfectly clear.
If you raise the price of the fucking hot dog, I will kill you.
Oh my.
Senegal said.
So figure it out.
Wow.
And that's sort of taken on, I mean, this like does the round every couple of years
the story, but it's such like a great bit of Costco myth making.
Doesn't Costco also have pizza?
They do.
This Costco episode is going to be fun.
It was so delicious.
I ate so much.
I was eating ice cream.
I was eating pizza.
Did Andy get a hot dog too?
He got a hot dog as well.
Oh my God.
We had a really good time.
But yeah, the Costco hot dog is allegedly one of the best hot dogs in the United States.
And I have to agree after having one.
It's very good.
They're really good.
I'm impressed.
Another thing after I wrote this documentary, I found this book about hot dogs, which I love.
It's called Raw Dog.
Oh my God.
Which is a great title by Jamie Loftus.
It's such a fascinating deep dive into the hot dog.
It put me to shame.
I can't compete with this stuff.
David, do you wear condoms when.
We're talking about Raw Dog?
David, do you Raw Dog is what you wanted to say?
I wear condoms.
Absolutely.
I'm a big condom user.
Whenever I haven't used condoms, it always leads to trouble.
That's my motto.
Always leads to trouble.
Just use them.
I think that's right, right?
I mean, look, it depends what your situation is, obviously, whether you use them or not.
But I think unless you're in like a long-term partnership, in my experience, stop using
condoms, something's going to happen.
Yeah.
And do you show up to the date with your, you bring it in your new wallet?
In your condom wallet.
I haven't used any of those condoms you gave me.
Are they still in that wallet?
Yeah, it might still be in the wallet.
It's good to keep in there.
I've been too busy Raw Dogging.
But really, do you bring.
No, that's a really good question.
I definitely have occasionally bought condoms if I think sex might be on the table, on the
But also I've definitely been in situations where I haven't had condoms and that they've
had condoms.
So it's been fine.
I'm trying to think if there's ever been an incident where it's like, oh my gosh, we've
got to go and find some condoms.
Right.
Because that's a bit of a mood killer when suddenly you're on a shopping trip.
And when you turn up at like a gas station and you're just buying condoms, I find it's
embarrassing.
Everyone knows what.
You're doing.
You're up to.
But I kind of feel like this is old school of me, but I wish men would come with the condoms.
It should be.
I think it's sort of the responsibility.
Like, I feel like if you have a penis, have the penis cover.
Well, it happened to me that you were expected to have the condom.
I get.
I mean, we didn't end up using one and I don't like that.
Yeah.
And I think no, I think my general philosophy is if you have a penis and you're going to
use it, you should have a little penis cover ready to go on there.
I think it's just completely reasonable.
A hundred percent.
But isn't raw dogging such a horrible, like a horrific term to use?
Yes, it is.
That's why this book got my attention.
It's called Raw Dog.
The Naked Truth About Hot Dogs.
It really does look like a penis.
A dick.
Yeah.
I mean, penises are horrible things.
They're such awful.
They look either hilarious or disgusting.
It's not often you look at a penis and go, wow, God did a really great thing with that.
You know?
It's a fun appendage.
Yeah, it's fun.
I love having one.
Um, so I just want to quickly read you a little excerpt from Raw Dog, because there's this
great bit about the history, because obviously it came from Germany, but there was a great
line in here going even further back, just sort of about sausages.
She writes, the ancestral sausage goes back 20,000 years to the Paleolithic era.
The primordial dog pops up again in the Middle East during the first millennium BC, appearing
in Assyrian texts.
And then again, when Homer's The Odyssey turned blood sausages into a metaphor for you tell
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