Episode 574: The Kidnapping & Murder of Marion Parker (Part 2)

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Hey weirdos, I'm ash.

And I'm Elena.

And this is morbid.

Morbid, morbid in the afternoon. It's a spooky, rainy afternoon today.

Oh my God, the thunder.

I don't know why I would talk like this.

I don't know either. It feels very big. Ange the glasses gotta see the mirror.

We're just trying to make ourselves laugh before. I guess we're in part two of the kidnapping and murder of Marion Parker. And I will say that the absolute worst is over. Okay, that's good news.

I hope it's not Zany in a way where I'm going to be so horrifically pissed off.

No, oh, okay, at the end, you will go, yeah, yeah.

She's doing like, a little like the tiniest fist bump, but like, with the biggest impact, yeah, that.

Hell yeah.

Okay, all right, all right, let's go.

But it's going to be wild, it's going to be wild, it always is.

Here in these parts.

Here in these parts. So when we left you in part one, uh. They had discovered that William Hickman was the murderer. He was 19 years old. They were pursuing him all over the damn place.

The fact that he's 19 is still boggling my motherfucking mind.

They had spotted him in Portland, Oregon. Um, and then that's where a gas station attendant had seen him filling his tank. And like I said before, by this point, his photograph was literally everywhere. Yeah, you could not go somewhere without seeing this man's photograph.

That made me nervous.

Now, from the moment reporters were made aware of Marion's kidnapping, the press went wild as we talked about. I mean, they pursued this case. Crazy, yeah. But once the suspect was named and the investigators began their interstate pursuit of William Hickman, the coverage increased like a hundred folds.

Cause you said this was like one of the most, one of the biggest manhunts in L.A. history, right?

It was massive.

It's nuts.

Massive. But that wasn't all. During the first week of the investigation, newspapers included dozens of. It wasn't just front page, it was like all these articles in all of the newspapers, I mean, dozens of them. And like, talking about the kidnapper now that they had the identity.

There was not a safe corner in this earth for him.

Yeah, it reminds me of like the Night Stalker, where everyone was thinking that there's no safe place on earth for you. Fucker. Like, So we're looking for you, your photograph is everywhere, and when we see you, you're going to get fucked.

You're going to get got.

But in in now, like decades and decades later, similar events, like the one that we all think of, probably in our minds. Like the slow motion O.J. Simpson car chase in 1994. That was the same kind of coverage that this was receiving, like not on the television. But in 1927, nothing was covered like this, right? So it's like, when, when the O.J. Simpson case happened, that was massive news. But we had seen that kind of coverage before. Like, or that was at least, like, you know, the one of the ones that stands out in everyone's mind. In 1927, unprecedented, right?

Cause you can relate to that on some human level, you know, like not not all.

The details, obviously, but. But like anybody with a soul, can look at this and empathize and say, holy shit, like, I can't, like, I'm here with you and let's get this fucker.

Exactly.

Now, as investigators trailed Hickman from one state, you know, to another, all across the northwest. They were thinking that this would hopefully all be over soon and they would just have their killer. They were not enjoying this, like wild goose, chase chief Herman Klein told reporters on the night of December 21st. Cause, remember, this is all happening in the span of like a week, it feels like so much has happened.

It's also crazy that it's just like, literally, like, days before Christmas.

Days before Christmas, this is happening, he told reporters. The search, in my opinion, is near its end. We are all hopeful that here, that the search will provide success, will prove successful. And that the fiend will be under arrest within a few hours. I also miss when people would be referred to as fiends because it's a very good way to describe someone like this.

Just Peck.

But then when they asked him to step out of the car, a pistol fell from his pants pocket and that kind of gave him away.

Yeah, that'll do it.

After a brief round of questioning, Hickman gave up the ruse and exhaustedly said, Yes, I am Edward Hickman, William Edward Hickman, you're William Edward Hickman. People went by their middle names a lot back then, I feel like.

People still do even.

Yeah, it's true.

But way more common back then, you're right.

Now, on the morning of December 23rd, the day before Christmas Eve. Readers all across California were very relieved to hear that the quote unquote. Fox, who had absolutely terrified and terrorized them for the previous week, had finally been caught.

Forgot that he was referring to himself as the Fox.

The fox, like, gets so fucked.

It adds such a juvenile level to something, so not juvenile in any way.

It's very 19 year olds.

It is.

Like, you know, at first, Hickman attempted to deny having anything to do with Marion's kidnapping or murder.

Good luck with that.

But before long, he kind of got confronted with all the fucking evidence against him, so he came up with a new story. Before a crowd of reporters and law enforcement. He kind of proudly explained that he had been supporting himself on the money he'd made from small time holdups. And that's when he met Andrew Kramer and June Dunning, a couple from San Diego. And he said, We just held up drugstores and places like that.

And I just realized, that's why. When he went into school, he asked for the daughter because he would see her go to the bank with him. Exactly because she loved to go to work with her dad.

Because she would hang out with her dad because they had such a tight bond. Wow, yeah. So he watched this man have this close relationship with his daughter, who loved him and adored him. And he was like, Yeah, that's what I'm going to do.

12 years old.

Yeah, now this story he just told was, like, partially true. In the year leading up to the kidnapping, Hickman had been involved in several small time armed robberies, including one where a pharmacist and a police officer were shot and seriously wounded.

Oh my goodness.

But these robberies had been committed with his high school friend Welby Hunt, right? Not Andrew Kramer and June Dunning, and, in fact, as far as anyone could tell, they couldn't even find evidence to support that Kramer or Dunning even existed.

I was waiting for that.

But Hickman stuck to his story that it was Kramer, not he, who had murdered Marion.

Brie Seinfeld.

In fact, he claimed to the Los Angeles Times, Marion and I were like brother and sister. She liked me but did not like Kramer and said she would like to stay with me all the time.

No, that's not the truth. You sewed her fucking eyes open, How dare you?

Yeah, how dare you now? The story that he initially told investigators was bizarre and very dubious, according to Hickman Quote. He only wanted 200 or 300 out of the 1500, and they had planned to return the girl unharmed once the ransom was delivered. And he confessed to writing and sending the telegrams to the Parkers. Because, remember, he's got to make sure.

Right?

Um, but, he said, and he said he had made things seem much worse than they truly were, just to get Perry Parker to act faster. Which they do believe is probably true, but in reality, he said, he made it a point of making sure Marion was always safe. She promised not to make any noise, he said, and he said, So I didn't tie her down. And we drove around all afternoon and went to a show that night at the Rialto Theater in Alhambra.

Really, yeah.

They don't know if that's true.

Okay.

According to Hickman, it was Andrew Kramer who killed Marion. He said. Once they returned from the movies, Kramer supposedly took Marion, while Hickman placed that call to the Parker House. Because, remember, he's setting it up so that all the things make sense, yep, that he's involved in.

He did the calls and the writing.

Just that one thing we can't prove.

But not the murder.

Yeah, so he said he made the call to the Parker House, he went to send the telegrams. And Kramer took Marion, and he said. When Hickman next saw Kramer at the Bellevue arms on the 17th, Kramer was carrying a suitcase. And quote Open it up to reveal Marion's decapitated body.

Okay.

Kramer told Hickman the girl had been crying too much and he decided to stop her permanently. And said that the police had become too suspicious. Anyways and too much a part of this. So it was they were going to abandon the plan to move on anyway, okay? And Hickman said, I am terribly sorry she was killed because I sure liked her. And then he started to cry.

I think they have a couple of clues, also this is a clue in a murder, ma'am.

Well, that's, I'm like, just because they have a clue that your child murdered some other child. And she then broke down into sobs and yelled, My God, my God, they'll kill him, they'll kill him. They won't even give him a chance to say anything for himself. Which you feel for her like that?

Yeah, no.

Although they were deeply skeptical of his story, investigators in Los Angeles, you know, set out to do their due diligence and they went searching for Andrew Kramer and June Dunning.

Yeah.

And quickly learned that, well, maybe they were real people, perhaps they the people who kind of matched the who. They were were definitely not murderous accomplices described by Hickman. I figured as much. Oliver Andrew Kramer, who went by his middle name, had been an acquaintance of Hickman in Los Angeles. But he had been in prison since August 1927, and so he definitely couldn't be an accomplice in kidnapping and murder.

Oh, okay.

Uh, coincidentally, in their pursuit of this, the supposed accomplices investigators located a second man named Frank Andrew Kramer, who also had a girlfriend named Dunning. Oh, this was just coincidence.

Yeah.

But her first name was Mabel, and she had died nine months earlier.

Okay.

Even more coincidentally, Frank Andrew Dunning had also been in jail since August, so he, too, would not be able to have helped Hickman.

That's crazy.

Very weird coincidence.

Yeah.

When he was informed by a member of the press that his supposed accomplices had been in jail since August. And, you know, some of them did not know him. Hickman laughed and said When I get to Los Angeles, I want to see Kramer and would like to see the girl too. What? And then he went on to speculate that Andrew Kramer, with whom he'd been operating with, could have used the name of a man in jail. Saying That is strange, it can't be.

Yeah, it sounds that way.

Now, if Edward Hickman didn't have accomplices, then that would mean that he was solely responsible for every horrible thing that happened to Marian Parker. But what everyone wanted to know was why, why did he do it? It seemed impossible that he would have kidnapped, murdered and mutilated a child for $1,500. And, if not for his reason, that, he said. Most simply assume that he was not sane. They were like, he has to be insane. In fact, even before he left Oregon for Los Angeles, Hickman himself had begun to openly question his own sanity.

Tell me this man's didn't answer.

That same guard would later tell a reporter that Hickman seemed proud of what he did and regarded his death. Notes quote unquote that he sent to Perry Parker as his quote. Masterpieces. Wow, yeah.

So he's just fucking deranged.

He's a piece of shit now. When Hickman while he was, you know, pondering his own sanity out loud for everyone to hear, uh. Psychiatrists in Oregon very publicly refuted the notion that he was insane, according to psychiatrist Dr. W..D. McNary, who evaluated Hickman while he was being held in Oregon.

That's even scarier.

Now, McNary had acknowledged that he had only spent a short time with Hickman. And so he said, I can't make any definitive, you know, diagnoses. Yeah, but in his opinion, he said, he didn't seem to be suffering from any symptoms associated with any kind of deviancy that one would expect from a killer. Wow.

I mean, there was that weird aspect of, like him, questioning, um, Perry's Christianity in there.

Absolutely.

I don't know what that has to do with, like anything else, though.

Now, in hindsight, it's pretty clear that Edward Hickman was enjoying the performative and dramatic aspects of the chaos that he had created. Um, you know, the cryptic telegrams, his public declarations, like, he's really feeding into it. But what's less clear is like, what is the truth and what isn't? He's told several stories now and he's like, switched them a few times, yeah.

Like, what actually happened and why?

So while in custody in Oregon, um, he was, he was still. He did the same thing again. He was pondering, You know what, how do crazy people act, essentially? And then he said that he, um. He said out loud to another guard that he could avoid punishment by claiming that he was crazy. Uh-huh. And then, a short time later, he all of a sudden claimed to be profoundly religious, saying that he if because he was captured. It must have been that God willed it, and he said, if God willed it, that it had to be.

Maybe that's part of the problem.

And obviously, I mean, people were like, maybe it's possible he believes what he's saying here, maybe. But most people believed that were around him. That the second he was arrested, that he just started laying the groundwork for an insanity defense, like, it was pretty clear.

Kind of seems that way.

Cause he wasn't, as we'll see, he doesn't do a good job. Okay, he's a very smart man, really. he's almost too smart to pretend to be insane.

Okay.

Because he's not, he's coming off too clear and too coherent, and too able to organize his thoughts. So, like his intelligence, it makes it hard for him to appear disorganized and like, scattered. Like you would assume, like a psychiatrist would assume to see in someone who's suffering from delusions or something else. Although California common law had always allowed for an accused person to claim insanity, what's now known as diminished capacity as their defense for their actions. Before 1927. This year, that that we're talking about a person, I'm like, I'm like, it's not 1927, guys, just a, just a.

Brief reminder We're not in the past.

You did not get in a time machine, don't worry, um. But before 1927, a person who'd been charged with a crime didn't have the option of pleading not guilty. By reason of insanity, huh? So basically what it meant was by claiming insanity as your defense, you had to first confess to the crime.

Yeah, I didn't know that. I'm surprised we haven't come across that before.

Yeah. In 1927, the Legislature amended the California Penal Code to allow for the plea of not guilty by reason of insanity. Where the defendant is asserting that they can't be held criminally responsible for their actions. Because you are insane at the time that you were alleged to have committed the unlawful act, um, and if that is the plea, then it's up to the judge or jury to determine whether the individual knew that their actions were illegal or immoral at the time. That they did them okay. And if so, they must then be held accountable for this.

Makes sense?

The key distinction between the former penal code and this new, amended one is that in the newer one. They are pleading not guilty, and if the judge or jury agrees, then they effectively are acquitted. Wow, so it's like before that wasn't going to happen. Now. If the judge and jury agree that you didn't know what you were doing and you can't be held accountable, you can be acquitted.

I wonder if there's anything in place for, you know, you know, getting care afterward.

Yeah, I'm a 1927, who knows, yeah.

Maybe not then, but hopefully now.

Now, Hickman, at this point, had already confessed to kidnapping and now killing Marion Parker. Okay, he confessed to the whole thing. But if he entered a plea of not guilty by reason of insanity and a jury agreed, there was a good chance that he was just going to avoid punishment completely. But first, in order to do that, he had the daunting tasks ahead of him by. But he had to convince countless law enforcement professionals and doctors that he was truly insane, okay?

Yeah, if you have that understanding, I'm I'm not going to bet money that you're insane or or were at that time.

He went into this knowing if I convince everybody that I'm insane, I can just go Scot-free, right? But what he didn't know was how to convince people that he was insane. That's why he's asking people.

Yeah.

Uh, his attempt to convince Dr. McNary that his crimes had been the result of his extreme, um, religiosity, essentially.

Religiosity.

There was, you know, divine command was given to him it. It was completely unex unsuccessful. Yeah, they didn't buy it. Um, in fact, the doctor told a reporter, I would not say that his aversion. And this is interesting. They really like, Um, cause we're in the twenties, of course, they really harp on, like how he didn't like girls.

Oh, okay.

But with this one, he says, I would not say that his aversion to women is evidence of perversion. Nor do I think that his religious convictions are so pronounced as to produce a hallucination that God willed that he commit this act. Yeah, so he's like, I don't think he has any kind of perversions, like, you know, in that sense. And I don't think he's so religious that he's like hallucinating God, telling him to do things.

It doesn't seem like that to me either.

But he's trying to convince people he is. Now. Hickman is realizing that he couldn't convince the guards that he was insane and, in fact, had asked them how to act crazy. Quote unquote.

Which like, why'd you do that for him?

And he's a smart guy. That's the worst part about this. And now Dr. McNary is like, No, I don't buy it either, like I don't buy the religious component.

Go for it.

The performance caused many people to speculate, Uh, maybe he is insane, but Keyes quickly dismissed that belief, telling reporters, Of course, he's not insane. He's merely assuming that pose, I presume, for mercy. So everybody around him was like, fuck off.

Nice try.

While Hickman made his best attempt at proving and performing what he thought was insanity at the jail cell, reporters, detectives and investigators from the DA's office started digging into his background. Because they were like, All right, you want to claim this? Let's see what we got back here. So, uh? Hickman's parents had divorced when he was 12 years old, and his mom moved him and his siblings to Kansas City, Missouri. Uh, when he got there, he soon became a very popular student, he was a star athlete, a member of the newspaper, the Yearbook Committee.

That's so crazy.

But he had a dark side that had started showing in little bits by the time his family had arrived in Missouri. He started shoplifting around age 11. Uh, and that soon escalated to petty theft and eventually armed robbery. Most people didn't know about the thefts and robberies. He kept it pretty under wraps, but there were still signs of like, something going on. Like, he had a lot of. He had honestly a lot of success after arriving at his new school, like we talked about.

Wow.

And it immediately went into like, rage, and and so, and everybody was like, Okay, he's going to get over this. But he didn't like. He brooded on it for like, a long time, held on to it, like, and this is just like him losing a competition at school.

Right?

And they said, And soon, there was noticeable changes in him, and they were definitely for the worse. The older he got, the more sullen, more disinterested he became. He didn't really express empathy or care for others. Very well, okay?

Yeah.

In their robbery spree during 1926 to 1927, Hickman quickly lost any reluctance to use a gun. He was like, Sure, let's go. Uh, there was a robbery in Los Angeles where he shot and killed a pharmacist and badly wounded an LAPD officer. Uh, that was the one we talked about before he actually killed the pharmacist.

Oh yeah, okay, yeah, it's horrifying that that's kind of what happened like, to a degree.

And so investigators were looking at this and saying, Huh, he's getting increasingly more violent. That is a violent statement to make. Like, it's not looking like insanity, it's looking like he's an angry and violent man.

That's so scary.

Also, they all noted that he was very clearly intelligent and he had an advanced communications skillset. Um, in. In fact, he seemed adept at avoiding any questions that might incriminate him or reveal criminality. He was actually pretty good at that.

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Although Hickman likely thought he was in control of the situation throughout these interviews because that's the kind of person he is. It was really his cunning and clear headedness during all of this that undermined his claims of insanity. It just kind of it didn't help. Like the more like he thought. He was like working around shit and being really cunning and like figuring it all out. They were like, Yeah, we see you doing that, right.

Some people really are like, Truly, you're dart.

Uh, so it was during this time that Hickman began to make up a story that he would use in his defense in court. It was the story that he would really hang on to, at least through court. When asked directly by one of the psychiatrists whether he believed he was insane, Hickman responded I don't think I'm insane. It was claimed for me, and he went on to explain. In writing, he said The murder of Marian Parker and the horrible, terrible, simply awful mutilation of Marian Parker's helpless body. A separate deed from the kidnapping of Marian Parker. A distinct crime done in blood by my own hands on the morning of December 17th, 1927, in the bathtub and apartment number three 15 at the Bellevue Arms Apartment of Los Angeles, California, was not mean by me. Edward Hickman.

So he's trying to come off cray cray.

Apparently so that I don't know if that's, that's weird, and I don't know what he's really saying there. So luckily they they also felt that way. At first, they were like, we need to clarify this a little bit.

All right, yeah, sure.

A very long winded way of saying that. On January 3rd, 1928, Hickman appeared in California Supreme Court with his attorney, Jerome Walsh, where, as expected, he entered a plea of not guilty. By reason of insanity. And for the first time since his arrest, he seemed to be taking it seriously. Finally, because before this, he seemed like he was just going to dance all around and get out of this through his own cunning. Now he kind of felt like he was like, I don't know if it's working, yeah.

Yeah.

Um, a trial date was set for January 25th, and the judge, hoping to expedite the trial. Exercise his right to examine the jury members himself, rather than go through the whole jury selection process. That would definitely delay the trial because there would be so many objections by the defense, the judge's decision to examine the jurors, the prospective jurors on his own. It was probably good because after a month of dense news coverage, there was no one in California who hadn't formed a pretty strong opinion of this case. But that wasn't the only thing working against the defense. Hickman had now changed crucial parts of his story multiple times, which meant his credibility was just zilch.

It's like, Dude, if Providence is asking all these things of you, you might be a little stressed.

You might be under a little bit of, you know, a little bit of stress now. The trial began January 25th, 1928, at the Hall of Justice in downtown Los Angeles. Which I was like, Wow, what a name, Hall of Justice.

Sounds like something in a superhero movie.

It does, it really does, um, but there was like a massive, very unruly and very angry mob, I believe it just camped out.

Also, find a fucking person that's not going to have any bias. In this case, you murdered a 12 year old, dismembered her and sewed her eyes open.

Like, shut the fuck up. And Judge Hardy was right to take on the, you know, the the job of going through the prospective jurors. Because the jury selection took nearly a week just to get the first out. Wow, um. The case finally began on February 2nd, like actually began, since Hickman had already confessed to the kidnapping and murder. At this point, the stated purpose of the trial was really just to determine his sanity and pass the sentence.

Yeah, I would say asa.

Uh, he clearly articulated the state's theory that it was vengeance that motivated Hickman to kill, not mental illness. Agreed, they actually brought out the um, which nobody knew up until this point, that Perry Parker was one of the people who testified against him at the hearing over his forged checks.

Oh, shit.

And as a result, they theorized that he devised this horrific scheme to get back at the bank. And Parker was just one of those that was caught up in it. Yeah, by kidnapping his daughter and killing her. Also, the plan had never truly been about money at all. In fact, by the time Hickman called to arrange for the second exchange, Marion was already dead.

Imagine that.

He said He told me that he would throw a fit for the judge and asked me what I thought of the fit he had thrown in the Pendleton jail. There it is. Marion's teacher, Mary Holt, was also called to testify. But she had become so emotionally and physically fragile at this time that she actually needed her husband's assistance to even reach the witness stand. Oh wow, so when I did, I I meant it, when I said she shouldered the weight of what had happened.

He's 19 years old. And like I said, I think in part one. He was able to convince this woman in a position of, you know, like authority that he was fine to go take this girl.

And they? And it only proved further that he had been very lucid and very calculating, and that this plan was meticulously done and performed. Um, the day also included graphic crime scene photos, including photos of Marion's body Oh wow, which caused one of the female jurors to collapse. And they had to recess. Mm-hmm.

Sane.

I had warned PM Parker to keep the case secret and private, but this, this, he was not reasonably able to do. So that the great publicity and search which followed caused me to use what I considered the greatest precaution in protecting myself. Two, Marion had a strong confidence in me for her own safety, and I considered her own wish to return to her father. Saturday morning. Too deeply, however, my desire to secure the money and return to college were even greater. I knew that if I refused to take her back Saturday morning, she might distrust me enough to give me some sign which would cause my discovery.

Sane, sane, sane, sane.

Are giant, booming green flags of sanity, right?

Like you planned this entire thing, you had everything mapped out.

Jerome Walsh Which I'm like, what were you thinking? He entered the handwritten confession to try to, like, prove his insanity, but it just did the exact opposite. Each of these motives clearly indicates that he knew he was legally and morally doing something wrong, and that he'd only done it. To not be detected, to not be caught. And also, the document reintroduces the previously abandoned story about wanting the money to return to school. While only making a very vague allusion to the, you know, religiosity that led him to commit the murder.

Yeah.

The confession was further undermined by at least one of the evaluating psychiatrists, who told the press that in his discussions with Hickman, he had rejected the confession entirely. So it's like, none of it makes sense.

None of it.

Like, they're not helping themselves, this is Zany, they're looking more like they need to, like, be seen by a doctor than anything else. It's like, what's going on? Like, you're not making this at all a coherent trial.

Not at all.

And so Jerome Walsh, in his client's defense, called several witnesses to try to establish a long history of instability. Hickman's father, Thomas Hickman, explained that his ex-wife, Eva, had always been melancholy and had a difficult time when she was pregnant with Edward.

Pregnancy is pretty hard.

Yeah, she said, had a difficult time when she was pregnant in the twenties, probably even harder. Yeah, he told the jury there was there was part of the time that she did not know anything.

Okay.

And it's okay. And so Walsh's trial. He also cited his history of criminality and unusual behavior, not being able to get over supposed losses. And he was trying to establish that Hickman had been raised in an unstable and overly religious household. Okay, because apparently he had a very religious grandfather, and he claimed that the influence was wild.

I was going to say, like, intelligent to a fault.

Among the least helpful witnesses called by the defense was Dr. Skoug Skoug Skoug, one of the psychiatrists who evaluated Edward following his arrest.

But he goes by Edward.

He goes by both.

Yeah.

And usually, I'll just call him Hickman, uh, reading from a transcript of an interview Skoug conducted with Hickman. Um, Skoug's deposition was probably intended to validate the you know, that Hickman believed in this Providence God. Quote unquote. But the back and forth between Hickman and Skoug was probably more confusing for the jury than it did to help the case at all.

Okay.

Because, before leaving the stand, Skoug concluded that Hickman's visions of providence stemmed from a grandiose delusion that was common in paranoid schizophrenics. So now he's saying that he's a paranoid schizophrenic.

That's a big leap.

But before that, he had so confused the jury and made no sense and connected nothing. And then it was just like he's probably a paranoid, schizophrenic. See you later, guys, and just like, let's just stand and say so. The jury was like, I don't even know what you just said, like, that makes no sense to us.

Yeah, what?

It's wild, so. Also of note was the extent of time that the defense and the various psychiatrists spent on Hickman's sexuality. And this is strange because, according to the coroner, Marion's body showed no evidence of sexual assault. Nor had anyone claimed that Hickman or anyone else had sexually assaulted her at any time. But during the trial, a considerable and very uncomfortable amount of time was devoted to Hickman's sexual interests, his masturbatory habits, his sexual experiences with women. Weird, she wasn't sexually assaulted.

Well, I was wondering why it even came out, like at one point, it was like it doesn't appear he even likes girls. I'm like, why does that matter right now?

He didn't assault her in that way. So it's like, why are we talking about that?

Well, it's just like in the Heavenly Creatures episode.

It made me think of that, yeah.

Where it's just like, it's not a sexually motivated crime.

Yeah.

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According to one of his Kansas City school friends, Hickman Quote had a number of sweethearts while in school, but he never ran around with girls. And they're all like reporting this in, like the New York Times and shit, and it's like, that's also conflicting itself.

He had a number of sweethearts, but he didn't go around with them, like, but then where did he go with them?

And we sit here and we're like, to us, this is wild and just like, what? Like? Very confusing. But at this point in history, mental illness, particularly when it resulted in crimes against children, was often conflated with sexual deviance. So many Americans, including medical professionals at this time, would assume that there had to be a sexual component of Hickman's psychosis here. So they would like basically think they had to shoehorn this in.

It's strange.

But again, it's of the time, very much so. Now the hearing came to a conclusion and that probably also, sorry, I like, cut myself off. That probably also didn't help to stop the jury from being so fucking confused by all this, yeah.

Cause they're like, this doesn't really have a place here, so why are we even talking about it?

The defense, like from what it looks like the prosecution has has kind of, like, given out a very coherent, pretty straightforward case. Yeah, seems to be revenge. Hey, look, he has a history of crimes and violence. Yup.

And by his own omission, he wanted to to, uh, do like a great crime. yeah, like, carry out a great crime.

And it's like, and he clearly has some violent tendencies, like, looks like it just. He wanted, he said himself, he wanted the money, so it all kind of adds up here it is. And then the defense is like, Oh no, we got it. And then the defense makes like, 40,000 different claims that all contradict each other and are confusing. As hell of like. Is he like? Does he have religious mania?

Do you think that was the goal, though, of the defense to confuse the jury?

But I think it backfired greatly on them, cause they're it's just not a coherent case that they've tried to prove here.

But I could see, I could very much see that being the goal all along.

I think other than they didn't have anything like they had to just confuse the jury, because other than that, it's pretty black and white. Like the I don't know the motive still seems fuzzy, because, like, who the fuck does that? as like revenge, who the fuck does that for money?

Like, people do crazy shit for money in revenge.

I think part of it is like, at this time in history, too, no one could could understand.

People just do these things sometimes.

He just did this and that he's a fucked up monster and that there isn't a true motive behind it. Maybe there was little things like he was pissed when he got fired from the bank, and maybe he did want to, but he just wanted to ruin someone's life.

And he also, he just wanted to take someone's life.

Take someone's life to ruin someone's life.

And it's like you even were saying, I like in the beginning how much he liked talking about it and everything. I think he wanted that notoriety, whether it be good or bad.

Exactly, and the hearing came to a conclusion in mid-February, with both sides giving very impassioned closing statements. Um, Walsh told the jury, the defense said. When mental disease distorted the boy's thinking processes, he became incapable of attaining his life's goal. When Hickman hung that little dead body down over the bathtub, drain and cut the throat with a kitchen knife. When he dressed what remained of her and her school clothes, when he rused her face, supplied lipstick to her to that little dead mouth. He was not malingering, he was completely mad.

That was a good one.

Yeah, now. There had been many criminals throughout the state's history, and many of them had committed heinous acts like Hickman's Um. And as far as he was concerned, they weren't insane either, he said. They're just evil. Not everyone has, like, some kind of defect that we can label with a diagnosis.

Like, some people are just fucked.

Some people don't have a conscience, and they don't have a heart, and they don't have a soul. They're just fucking damaged goods and this is one of these people and we got to get them off the fucking street a little after 2 20 p.m. On February 14th, Valentine's Day. Judge Trabuco dismissed the jury for deliberations. But before he did, he reminded them of their purpose.

May he not?

May he not? Hickman showed no emotion when he was handed over to the sheriff's deputies and taken out of the courtroom. When the crowd of nearly 2000 spectators outside heard the outcome, a giant cheer rose through the air.

That's amazing.

Now, Jerome Walsh immediately filed a motion for a new trial.

You want us to try to do this again, yeah.

For a motion for an arrest of judgment, they were both quickly denied. Following the denial, the defense filed an appeal with the California Supreme Court on Hickman's behalf, arguing that when he was forced to plead and to go to trial. Under the form of procedure now prescribed by the penal code of this state and the procedure to be followed. After the plea, he was deprived of his constitutional right to a trial by jury. Now, according to Hickman's lawyers, their client had confessed to participating in the kidnapping, but always said he was innocent when it came to the murder.

Not always.

Not always by entering a plea of not guilty by reason of insanity. He was forced to plead guilty to both crimes, and they said that violated his rights. The justices considered the argument but ultimately rejected their appeal on the grounds that the state's constitution only guarantees that the citizens of the state shall have an opportunity to be tried by a jury by entering a plea of not guilty by reason of insanity, he knew the two charges would be considered together and that the hearing could result in him being sentenced to death.

There you go.

They were also unwilling. The justices were unwilling to consider an argument calling into question the newly passed law allowing for such a plea. During this period. A separate trial was held where Hickman and Welby, his friend there, were tried for the murder of Ivy Toms during the robbery of the drugstore in February 1926..

I was waiting to hear if something happened from that.

The jury deliberated briefly and then found them both guilty. Good, but at that point, Hickman had already been sentenced to die. So it was kind of a moot point, but like, glad to have had it on the books.

Yeah, and Welby at least got had to pay for what he did.

Exactly by the fall of 1928, Walsh had exhausted every single appeal available for his client, and Hickman's execution was scheduled for October 19th. At this point, like most, he had embraced the Roman Catholic faith and jail suddenly out of nowhere. And he sent a letter to Chief of Police for Los Angeles on October 13th, where he confessed to additional crimes, including five robberies and the theft of several automobiles in the city between 1926 and 1927..

What a standup guy.

According to Hickman, the additional confessions were quote unquote the Christian thing to do, and he wanted to get right with God before he went to the gallows.

You kidnapped a 12 year old, held her captive for multiple days, killed her after giving her the hope that she was going to be reunited with her family again. Dismembered her body, sewed her eyes open, and then put makeup on her, put makeup on her. Sorry, I can't forget that. And then drove her to her father and threw her out your passenger door.

Oh, and then drove a little ways away and threw her arms and legs into various places. Fuck off into the sun. And then he's like, I got to get right with God. I'm like, isn't that kind of like cramming for the final exam, like three minutes before the test? yeah?

I'm like, if there is a God, I don't think he wants you.

I don't know about that, sorry, I don't know about that. On the morning of October 19th, a little after 10 a.m. He was led from his cell at San Quentin and taken to the gallows that had been assembled in the yard. Before a crowd of nearly 200 people.

Oh, wow, they're still doing crowds.

Yeah, and what's funny is, for about a year, you know, the The Press had labeled him the Fox, and he had labeled himself the Fox. This diabolical genius. And um, and they had been talking about how cunning he was and blah, blah, blah. But a lot of people in the crowd were like, Wow, he doesn't look like the fox right now.

Where's the Fox?

Um, the young man standing before them at the gallows was not the raving monster or this cunning fox that they talked about, but a white faced boy of 20. And they mean, white faced. Like all the blood has rushed out of his face and he is about to pass out, and oh, he does pass out, cause he's a little bitch. There it is now. According to one reporter, he seemed very young as the hush of death silenced the assembly, gazing up at the human being who was about to die. He trembled as he was positioned over the trap door and basically collapsed when the hood was placed over his head, like, literally fainted.

The poetic Justice, because, if you recall, she was strangled.

Yep, yep, thank you for bringing that back, because I mean.

Tell me, karma's not a thing.

And in fact, during this whole thing, multiple spectators fainted wow, and a guard threw water on them to bring them back up.

Oh my goodness.

Sounds like it was like, it's okay now, after all, everything, everything. Now he's dead, he's gone. A whole year had gone by with them reporting this like round the clock. Hickman died without ever honestly explaining why he kidnapped, murdered and mutilated Marian Parker.

I don't know that there was a reason, a genuine black and white reason.

I don't think he had one reason.

I think it lived in the gray.

He wanted to, and there was some reasons that he felt justified it. Yeah, in his own sick mind, and not sick in that way, but like sick.

Like, twisted, I agree.

And that is the horrifying tale, with at least an ending that has some justice to it, of the kidnapping, murder and mutilation of Marian Parker.

So sad.

It is, wow, but and what it? It's like the trial got so wily and he tried so hard, watching him fight for that insanity defense while fucking it up for himself and Eddie.

He wanted to get back out there on the streets and do what he was good at armed robberies and murder.

Exactly, he would have done something again, there's no doubt in my mind.

Probably something worse if you're capable of that.

He was only 19.

My god, yeah.

This guy's only 19.

Sad that that it it took that to catch him.

Yeah.

Wow, yeah, that's one of the more fucked up cases we've ever covered.

Yeah.

Well, with that being said, we hope you keep listening, and we hope you keep.

It weird, bye bye.

If you like Morbid, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at Wondery.com Slash Survey.

I'm Dan Taberski. In 2011, something strange began to happen at the high school in Leroy, New York.

I was like at my locker and she came up to me and she was like, stuttering, super bad. I'm like, stop around. She's like, I can't.

A mystery illness, bizarre symptoms and spreading fast.

Like doubling and tripling, and it's all these girls.

With a diagnosis, the state tried to keep on the down low. Everybody thought I was holding something back. Well, you were holding something back intentionally. Yeah, yeah.

No, it's hysteria, it's all in your head.

It's not physical. Oh my gosh, you're exaggerating. Is this the largest mass hysteria since the Witches of Salem, or is it something else entirely? Something's wrong here?

Leroy was the new dateline and everyone was trying to solve the murder.

A new limited series from Wondery and Pineapple Street Studios, Hysterical Follow Hysterical on the Wondery app, or wherever you get your podcasts. You can binge all episodes of Hysterical early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus.