Quit Spending Like You’re in Congress!

2024-07-11 01:58:26

The Ramsey Show believes you can build wealth and take control of your life—no matter what stupid mistakes you've made with money. Join as Dave Ramsey and his team of experts answer your questions on the top problems holding you back. Listen now or ask your question live by calling 888.825.5225 weekdays from 2–5 p.m. ET. Learn more at www.ramseysolutions.com

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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey Show, where we help people

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build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships.

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I'm Dave Ramsey, your host, Jay Barshaw, number one best-selling author. Ramsey Personality is

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my co-host today, as we answer your questions. The phone number is 888-825-5225. Ryan's in

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Seattle. Hey, Ryan, what's up? Hi, long-time listener. I just got an offer from my parents.

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They'd help me buy a house. I'd enter into a contract with them, where basically they would

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be the bank. They would fund the entirety of the purchase price, and I'd pay them back,

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including interest. They gave me a little bit better of a deal with the interest at about

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6.5%, instead of... It's around 7, 7.5%, around where I'm at. I was just curious on if it was

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going to be something I should do. I know you've talked about not buying a home with somebody

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you're not married to, but it is family kind of thing. The difference in interest, what does that

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amount to? I'm going somewhere with this, because that's the break you're getting, right? That's

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home. I'd pay off 75% of the home, and then when I sell it, they get their...

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So the purchase price is 400 grand. Yeah.

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They would be given back their 100,000, and then 25% of any profit that was made.

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So this gets very complex. Yes.

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Have you already done this?

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It's in the process of getting done right now.

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Can you, and are you willing to stop it?

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I think it's a great idea. It's not a great idea. It sucks beyond belief. It's a horrible idea.

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It's going to end in ashes. Please don't do it. Please don't do this.

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How old are you? 27. Okay.

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Just 10. When you're 30, and you're married, and you want to refinance the house,

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and you have to buy out the 25%, your wife is going to be so pissed at your parents.

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Don't do this. Is that because the value would be going up?

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Don't do this. You can't afford to buy a house, sounds like.

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Mm-hmm. If you can't afford to buy a house, go buy you a house, son.

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Do not do this. You guys are putting this all together like there's only one thing that can

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happen, and it's everything works out perfect. And 100% of the time, everything does not work

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out perfect. Everything that comes at this, if you want to refinance, you want to sell,

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they don't want to sell, you are now in partnership with people for no apparent

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reason except a half a percent. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

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And to go back to the first thing, it sounded like at first your parents were just trying to

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offer you, and it wasn't a good method, but it sounded like they were trying to offer you a

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break in interest. And my thought would have been like, well, calculate how much it is and just ask

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for it as a gift, and then you go buy the house. But they're really trying to make a profit.

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And so it's two things going on. It's you trying to get a house before you can afford it,

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and them trying to invest in real estate, and they don't really have the money to do that either.

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So it's two things that are gone awry. This is really bad, Ryan. I really wish I could

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talk you into not doing it. I don't think I can, though. I think you're too far into it.

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Yeah, you're done. Okay. Good luck, son. Please don't do it. I'm going to tell you one more time,

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there's 47 ways this can go wrong, and only one way it can go right, and you're going to

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experience one of the 47. You called and asked our opinion. I've got 30 years on this microphone,

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40 years of doing one-on-one coaching. I have never seen a deal like this work out.

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They always go sideways. You're asking to have a strain in a relationship with your parents

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over a stupid house, and you guys have these rainbows and unicorns and skittles in your head

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that this is all going to work out a certain way, and honey, it's not. So you're going to do it

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anyway, and you're going to learn the lesson the hard way, but you can remember the time you called

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and we told you not to do it. When you're sitting neck deep in the poop, you just remember that Dave

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and Jade told you not to do it. Yeah, because he's going to be neck deep in the poop.

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Katie's in Pensacola. Hi, Katie. What's up? Hi, Dave and Jade. Thank you for taking my call.

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Sure. So I just want to ask, what type of savings account should we keep the $110,000 that we have

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for a down payment on a home in the future? My husband is eligible to retire from the Air Force

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in three years, but we'll probably wait another two years, so five years total, to maybe buy a home.

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Yeah. Wow, nice. Well, if you're going to play close to a five-year window, you can talk about

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putting some or all of it towards something like a standard and poor, an S&P 500 mutual fund,

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and you'll make some really good money on it. That's what I do, okay? But it could go down in

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value. You know, you could put $110,000 in and it might be worth $100,000, but that would be a highly

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unusual five-year. 97% of the five-year periods in the stock market's history have made money.

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So I'm very comfortable with the risk, if you put it in and leave it alone five years. If you're

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going to leave it alone three years, probably not. You're probably going to go high yield.

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If you want to do a blend, I'd do some, like half of it in a mutual fund, an S&P 500 fund,

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and half of it in a high yield. But at least get some of this money working for you, because we're

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talking about the difference of about $10,000 a year in what you would earn on the money.

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So we're talking about $50,000 high yield versus a mutual fund over a five-year period of time.

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I also like the idea of investing it or doing the blend, because once you put it, you know,

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you put it in an index fund or you put it where you put it, you're less likely to touch it. You're

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less likely to have something pop up like your friend's, you know, wedding in the Caribbean

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that you think would be a good idea to spend some of that money on, right? Whereas if it's in a high

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yield, it's easy to grab some of it, you invest it, it's kind of locked away. High yields are a little too

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accessible. Yeah. Yeah, I like trying to keep it out of my own reach. I like to trick myself

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into becoming wealthy, you know, and trick myself into actually accomplishing my goals. And yeah,

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that's a good point. It's a very good point. It's always a wedding in the Caribbean.

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I don't know. What is it with you and the wedding in the Caribbean? That comes up a lot.

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Is this a scar in your life? It might be. It might be a friend out there somewhere that's...

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But you know how it is. Now suddenly you need a new car.

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Oh yeah. Well, you know, for a redneck, it's we need a bass boat.

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Oh.

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Need a bass boat. I need a side-by-side to go deer hunting in.

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Oh gosh.

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You know, and they're only, they're only 20 grand. I mean...

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You got that sitting in the high yield.

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You know, it's all... I got that money sitting over there. Why would, why would we, why would

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we pay a bank interest for the side-by-side? Your brain starts fogging up and it stops working. You

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can't see through the windshield anymore. Yeah, you're exactly right. That's a very good point.

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So I, I personally, I'm comfortable knowledge-wise with the history of the stock market.

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So I'm plunking all of it, if it's me, into an S&P 500, if you got a four or five-year window.

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If you're a little less comfortable, do some there and some otherwise.

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If you're completely, that freaks you out, just put it in a high yield,

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but you've got the downside of it's too accessible.

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You know, it becomes a bass boat fund or I need to redecorate the kitchen fund or...

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Yeah.

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Whatever the crap comes up. This is the Ramsey Show.

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We're going cruising boys and girls. We'd love to have you go with us. We're doing the Ramsey

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Live Like No One Else cruise. For those of you that are Baby Steps 4 and beyond, it's your

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opportunity to celebrate the milestone of getting into wealth building mode. All the Ramsey

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personalities including Jade and I and my wife Sharon will be with us the entire seven days

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on a high-end very nice Holland America almost brand new ship. We're going to Turks and Caicos,

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St. Thomas, Puerto Rico, the Bahamas and man this thing is packed full. We've got lots of

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fun cool friends coming like Stephen Curtis Chapman is going to hang out with us.

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Manit Chauhan from the Food Channel will be with us. We've got a lot of other celebs hanging and

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you guys come out. It's all Ramsey people on the boat all celebrating all saying we lived like no

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one else now by God we're cruising like nobody else. There you go. It's March, March, March, March, March

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22nd through the 29th this coming spring and if you don't want to pay the whole thing up front

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to do it because the cabins are going really fast. So get a cabin while you can. Ramseysolutions.com

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slash cruise. Paul's in Buffalo, New York. Hey Paul what's up? Hey how's it going man? Better than I

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deserve. How can we help? So kind of a crazy life event happened lately. I have kind of a

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strange uncle. I know him but probably haven't talked to him in 15-20 years and he passed away

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and my mother his sister is this executive of the estate and she calls me and says he left you about

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a half a million dollars. Whoa. You're the guy. I've always heard about a guy with a rich uncle.

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It was you. It happens. It happens. I always I never I didn't know where you were. I've always heard about

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you though. Paul in Buffalo. The guy is he's Paul in Buffalo. He's the guy with the rich uncle.

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Wow that's so cool. That's so cool. I hate it when I get a half a million dollars out of the blue.

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So little it's a good problem to have but I just don't really know what to do. I've been

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married for 21 years well not married but with my wife for 21 years. I'm 37. We have a house

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and we have two beautiful kids and I've listened to your show for a while and I know it's very

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centered around getting rid of debt but I just want to be smart. I've never had this type of like

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influx of cash flow before and I just don't want to make any mistakes and

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you know set my kids up and obviously take care of us in the immediate. So yeah that's very wise

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because this kind of a hit really could change your family tree if you're careful with it. So

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that's very wise and so how long before you actually receive the money do you think?

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I mean they said it's well that's another question too. So a lot of it is an investment

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and just from things I was reading online I've seen people where like the attorney will liquidate

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all the investments and then they get taxed really heavily on it and I don't know other

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things I was reading would like move it to a Roth and then inherit the Roth or something. I don't know.

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You can't move dead people's stuff into a Roth. It doesn't work. So that's internet

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garbage. So the investments should not have any investments don't have any taxes honey.

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So the deal is this now the attorney does if the attorney liquidates them or you liquidate

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them it doesn't matter. You now become the owner even if he liquidates them okay. You can ask him

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not to liquidate them and you can do it but here's the here's the tax law on that part and then we'll

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move on to the rest of it okay. So let's say that part of the 500,000 is I'll just make up something

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Home Depot stock okay and uncle paid 50 grand for the Home Depot stock but the Home Depot stock's

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worth 150 now. Your basis as the inheritance in an inheritance is current market value and so

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your tax is based on how much above current market value it is. It's called a stepped up basis

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okay. You do not get taxed on what he paid for it you get taxed only on what it's worth at the time

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of his death and if you sell it within six months of his death it is presumed to have been at market

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value by the by the IRS okay. So you got no taxes because so you take all this stuff if you want to

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if you want to liquidate all of it and have a half million dollar pile of cash in the middle of the

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table zero tax there's no income tax there's no inheritance tax. That's cool. Now okay so that

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answers that question so we don't have to we can move on past that. Now then the reason I ask how

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long before you get it is I want you to start pretending like you were hired suddenly to manage

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someone's half a million dollars and you've never done that before which is exactly what's happened

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right. God just gave you a half a million of his money and God says how you gonna manage it son

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and you're going this scares me a little bit I want to be careful and that's wise.

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So what you would do if you were hired by someone and you didn't know what you were doing

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you would get some other people on your team that knew what they were doing and so I want you to

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begin to gather up your own little personal committee your own little personal board of

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directors so to speak. So we're going to get a mutual fund broker a SmartVestor Pro off our

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website in your corner. We're going to get a an estate planning attorney in your corner. We're

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going to get some tax advice from an ELP and backup and make sure that Dave Ramsey actually

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gave you the right advice a while ago and check that with a pro okay and you can get an ELP a

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tax ELP off our site. We don't have estate planning attorneys on our site but we've got

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people we recommend for tax in Buffalo and for if you're going to do any real estate deals you can

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go get a real estate person in your corner. If you need insurance you need a good insurance broker

00:15:58.68 – 00:16:05.90

in your corner. Every one of these people do not qualify to be in your on your committee unless

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they have the heart of a teacher meaning your job is to manage their money their job is to teach you

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enough about their specialty to help you manage the money. Got it. You don't turn it over to them

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and go well I just gave it to this guy to manage and he lost it all. No your job is to manage it.

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You're taking advice from these other people and therefore their job is to teach you they have to

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have the heart of a teacher. Does that make sense? It does. And that will keep you out of trouble.

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Do not do anything with this money that you do not understand because it is your responsibility.

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Yeah because sometimes these people start talking it sounds like Charlie Brown's teacher.

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You remember that and so yep long time ago on that cartoon but yeah the anyway so

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uh all that to say then we're gonna have you work the baby steps right Jade? Yeah Paul what's your

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current financial situation tell us about your financial life before this money. Yeah well that's

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another like interesting thing I just had a business of 13 years and I sold it in January so

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I have about a hundred thousand dollars in assets that I still need to kind of get rid of

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okay and I have about twenty thousand dollars in cryptocurrency. As far as debt goes I have

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none and my wife has none. We don't have anything. Mortgage? Yeah. We own our house

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I think we owe about 130,000 and it's worth about 300. Okay so first thing I'd probably do after you

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have those people in place is I definitely want to pay off my mortgage and just be scot-free

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and then from there on I think they've set you up to have the right folks in your corner to decide

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what you're going to do about this money how you're going to invest it if it's going to be in

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the stock market if it's going to be in real estate. And my recommendation is take six hundred

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and twenty thousand dollars from bitcoin and sale of business and inheritance and put at the top of

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the page and spend it. We just spent 130 of it paying off the mortgage. What are we going to do

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with the rest of it? Okay I'll give you and then I'll tell you one last thing on that. A lump sum

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invested in a good mutual fund or series of mutual funds if it averages 10 percent or more

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will double every seven years. You're 37 you said? Yep. So let's pretend we put 400 in investments

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and when you're 44 you'll have 700. When you're 51 you'll have 1.4. When you're 58 you'll have 2.8.

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Yep. See how this changes your family tree? Exactly that's the thing like I said it's such

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yeah it's a good problem but it's kind of it's intimidating it's kind of scary all at once you're

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like. And the other two things you can do with money is have fun with it and be generous with

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it and you should do some of that with some of this money too. Notice I didn't invest at all.

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You're debt-free, you're generous, you have some fun and you invest and you keep your

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stinking hands off of it and let it double. This is the Ramsey Show.

00:19:12.18 – 00:19:18.76

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00:19:44.44 – 00:19:49.76

Thanks for joining us America. Jade Walshall, Ramsey Personality is my co-host. John's in

00:19:49.76 – 00:19:55.26

St. Louis. Hey John how are you? Not too bad myself. Better than I deserve. What's up?

00:19:56.04 – 00:19:59.18

I just called to try to get a little bit of advice from you Dave on

00:19:59.18 – 00:20:07.44

ways that my wife and I can tackle our monster debt that we have. Currently without our house

00:20:07.44 – 00:20:15.94

we are at $240,500. Good lord. Yes. What is a monster? What is the monster?

00:20:17.08 – 00:20:25.74

Unfortunately it's a lot of credit cards, student loans, it's a HELOC and a 401k loan

00:20:25.74 – 00:20:31.26

as well as two car payments. You never met a debt you didn't like.

00:20:32.44 – 00:20:35.42

No and unfortunately not. What's the income?

00:20:38.38 – 00:20:47.10

Our salary-wise is $151,600. I broke it down to what our yearly is should be roughly $99,840.

00:20:47.96 – 00:20:55.26

Okay so it sounds like you guys, I'm just trying to get my head around how this happened.

00:20:55.72 – 00:20:59.58

It sounded like you felt like you were making a good income and it was time to just go crazy.

00:20:59.86 – 00:21:05.40

Is that right? The credit cards is the biggest issue. How much is that? Unfortunately

00:21:05.40 – 00:21:17.54

of the credit cards $46,962 as of last month. Okay. How much on the cars?

00:21:18.46 – 00:21:28.42

The cars itself, my car is $28,700. My wife's is $21,000 and mine's due to be paid off in four

00:21:28.42 – 00:21:33.12

years. Hers is due to be paid off in three years. Well one of them's probably got to go.

00:21:34.64 – 00:21:43.02

The $28,000 one, what's it worth? I'm not entirely sure. It's a 21 Kia Sorento.

00:21:43.78 – 00:21:47.88

It's more of the family car. She has the more gas-efficient car.

00:21:48.16 – 00:21:51.44

What does she have? A Nissan Altima.

00:21:51.92 – 00:21:57.36

Well whatever one of these is the least upside down and of the most value, I'd probably try to

00:21:57.60 – 00:22:05.56

get into a cash car. John, I don't really care if it's the family car. You people are broke.

00:22:06.96 – 00:22:13.58

You're starving to death making $150,000 a year. You don't get to say it's the family car.

00:22:14.42 – 00:22:18.56

You get to say everything's on the table. We're selling so much stuff the kids think they're next.

00:22:20.12 – 00:22:25.28

We're not doing anything until we get this mess cleaned up because you guys have been spending

00:22:25.28 – 00:22:28.04

like you're in Congress for what, 10 years? How long have you been married? 10 years?

00:22:30.24 – 00:22:35.84

Four years. You guys did this in four years or did you get started early?

00:22:37.72 – 00:22:40.90

I mean the student loans is all my stuff. How much is that?

00:22:43.34 – 00:22:46.66

Unfortunately $80,000. Well that is the biggest portion,

00:22:46.82 – 00:22:48.70

not the credit card. And then the HELOC.

00:22:51.78 – 00:22:57.98

HELOC is $46,000 and that was just this past year.

00:22:58.84 – 00:23:03.48

What'd you do with that? Which unfortunately helped us pay off a bunch of credit cards.

00:23:03.84 – 00:23:06.22

No you didn't. You moved them.

00:23:06.46 – 00:23:09.50

It helped us consolidate them I should say. Yeah you moved them onto your house.

00:23:09.52 – 00:23:14.06

And it didn't help you consolidate them. It put your home at risk. So it's not a help.

00:23:14.06 – 00:23:20.78

And you didn't stop spending. You're still spending more than you make, right?

00:23:22.14 – 00:23:25.26

I would say yes. Have you cut up the credit cards?

00:23:26.64 – 00:23:34.08

No unfortunately not. I own myself. I use mine primarily for work related, which I know Dave,

00:23:34.20 – 00:23:40.12

I've heard you talk about before. I've expressed in my work they should get us all credit cards so

00:23:40.12 – 00:23:44.90

we don't have to use ours. Hopefully we can get that approved so I can stop using mine when I travel.

00:23:45.80 – 00:23:52.18

Apparently that's not working for you. You have $46,000 in credit card debt and a HELOC

00:23:52.76 – 00:23:56.42

that's $46,000. So it's basically $90,000 in credit card debt.

00:23:58.76 – 00:24:01.56

So something's broken with that system. Would you agree?

00:24:04.60 – 00:24:08.44

Yes. You don't end up $90,000 in credit card debt when something's working.

00:24:09.72 – 00:24:14.26

So no use of plastic is going to be okay in your house. You guys have to go cold turkey.

00:24:15.04 – 00:24:19.30

You don't walk around with a flask in your back pocket if you're trying to quit drinking.

00:24:24.20 – 00:24:27.96

Just curious, for the work part, because I want to know how much of that is an excuse,

00:24:28.32 – 00:24:30.74

how much are you putting on your credit card every month for work?

00:24:32.06 – 00:24:38.36

I mean, it's not that much. The card that's got the biggest amount, I take the full blame for it.

00:24:39.04 – 00:24:42.88

Miscellaneous stuff. That had nothing to do with work, yeah.

00:24:43.66 – 00:24:46.78

My point is, if you're spending a little bit here or there for work

00:24:46.78 – 00:24:52.32

and they're reimbursing you, you don't need a credit card for that. You shouldn't be doing that.

00:24:53.94 – 00:24:57.98

Let's reset here for a second. Does this scare you?

00:24:59.74 – 00:25:07.88

Yes, because it's continual. As a family-wise, we would be better off financially.

00:25:08.58 – 00:25:12.02

The credit cards I look at, it's one of the scariest things.

00:25:14.62 – 00:25:18.16

It's scary. The math is not scary. What's scary is the pattern

00:25:18.90 – 00:25:23.74

of being out of control and staying out of control. That's what scares me. It's not sustainable. You

00:25:23.74 – 00:25:28.84

know this is heading towards the wall and you're going to T-bone the wall and just blow the whole

00:25:28.84 – 00:25:34.18

thing up, right? You know that's what's coming. Because you guys just continue the same pattern.

00:25:34.90 – 00:25:37.94

We're in it. You can't get out of a hole by digging out the bottom, right?

00:25:38.56 – 00:25:44.66

Now, how's your wife feeling? We're both just as stressed with it.

00:25:45.08 – 00:25:50.44

Okay. Are y'all fighting about this stuff? We try to talk about it and she gets stressed

00:25:50.44 – 00:25:53.48

and doesn't want to talk about it. Y'all are fighting about this?

00:25:53.48 – 00:25:57.26

Yeah. It would be weird if you're not having a bunch of fights,

00:25:58.10 – 00:26:03.06

because this stuff is the number one cause of divorce in North America. It's the number one

00:26:03.06 – 00:26:07.24

cause of disagreement in marriages is money problems and money fights. You got them all up

00:26:07.24 – 00:26:10.50

and around your ears. Here's what we're going to do. We're going to help you. I want to give you

00:26:10.50 – 00:26:17.58

an overarching plan. I've been where you are, except worse. I remember being terrified. I

00:26:17.58 – 00:26:22.22

remember my wife being terrified. I remember us trying to kill each other. I don't want that for

00:26:22.22 – 00:26:32.20

you, okay? The plan I'm going to give you does not have a middle ground. It is not an easy process.

00:26:32.20 – 00:26:38.16

The result is a hundred percent. You're going to win and you're going to become a millionaire,

00:26:38.92 – 00:26:46.60

but the path to get there is painful because you guys have a series of behaviors, habits,

00:26:47.28 – 00:26:53.94

and even language that you use in your own heads and at each other that has got to completely change

00:26:55.44 – 00:26:58.96

because your behaviors, your habits, and the language you use around this stuff.

00:26:58.96 – 00:27:01.90

As soon as I start talking about the car, you start talking. It's a family car

00:27:02.80 – 00:27:09.22

as if it's a non-starter. It's not a non-starter. It's a stupid car and your family's almost

00:27:09.22 – 00:27:17.46

bankrupt. It's the enemy. It's not the family car, okay? So you change your vernacular around this.

00:27:17.52 – 00:27:26.16

You go, anything that is between me and freedom is the enemy. We are going to freaking war

00:27:26.98 – 00:27:32.92

with our lifestyle and our former patterns of doing things. We are not going to do this anymore.

00:27:33.08 – 00:27:37.06

If you're ready to enter into that, I can show you how to do it. If you want to play around and

00:27:37.06 – 00:27:40.88

think there's a math trick to hack you out of this, you got the wrong guy. I can't help you,

00:27:41.70 – 00:27:45.02

but I can show you. I've shown millions of people how to get out of debt. We'll put you

00:27:45.02 – 00:27:50.20

into Financial Peace University. I'll pay for it free and we'll pay for you to be on every dollar

00:27:50.20 – 00:27:54.04

of the premium side of the app and get you in the every dollar app and you and your wife sit down

00:27:54.04 – 00:27:58.04

together. Crap, I'm not even going to put a coach in your corner. We got one of our Ramsey coaches

00:27:58.04 – 00:28:02.84

in your area. I'm going to pay for a personal coach to coach you, but only if you're willing

00:28:02.84 – 00:28:11.48

to say, I'll do whatever I have to do to win. Okay. All right. We can get rid of this fear,

00:28:11.58 – 00:28:16.74

man. And here's the weird thing. Before the debt belief, the fear will be gone. You'll still have

00:28:16.74 – 00:28:20.00

the debt, but you won't have the fear anymore because you'll see your way out. You'll see a

00:28:20.00 – 00:28:23.30

light at the end of the tunnel that's not an oncoming train. The only thing you know right

00:28:23.30 – 00:28:29.28

now is you're stuck and you're not stuck. What's stuck is the stupid crap that brought you to here.

00:28:29.38 – 00:28:36.66

It's the same stupid crap that made me go broke. And they got Jade to what? 460. 460,000 in debt.

00:28:37.06 – 00:28:40.92

The lady to my right and paid it off, her and her husband. So you can do this when they weren't

00:28:40.92 – 00:28:47.42

making anywhere near a hundred and a half. So you hang on. This place is about hope,

00:28:47.88 – 00:28:53.12

but it's not about false hope. You're going to live like no one else, man. Your friends

00:28:53.12 – 00:28:58.70

are going to think you joined a cult. You're going to be going cray cray, man, completely

00:28:58.70 – 00:29:03.76

different than anything you've ever done in your life, but you'll be free in 36 months.

00:29:04.28 – 00:29:08.06

Hang on. I'll pay for it. Christian will pick up and get you taken care of, brother.

00:29:10.94 – 00:29:16.84

So here's a quick math refresher. There are only 24 hours in a day. So your business needs to

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one platform. So join the more than 37,000 smart businesses like Ramsey Solutions that have done

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the math and graduated to NetSuite. And right now you can download NetSuite's KPI checklist

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absolutely free at NetSuite.com slash Ramsey. That's NetSuite.com slash Ramsey.

00:29:58.24 – 00:30:07.32

Jade Walshall, Ramsey Personality is my co-host. Open phones at 888-825-5225. We appreciate all

00:30:07.32 – 00:30:11.76

the help you guys have been giving us and encourage you to continue to give us that help. And the help

00:30:11.76 – 00:30:18.54

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Apple, Google Play, whatever, just click the follow or the subscribe button. It makes a big difference

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00:30:30.58 – 00:30:35.58

how they push it forward to other people to see it. Thank you for doing that. Share the show. Let

00:30:35.58 – 00:30:40.28

people know we're here. Click a link and send it to somebody. I sent a funny Instagram to all my

00:30:40.28 – 00:30:45.34

buddies this morning. That happens all the time, right? And you can do all that share stuff that

00:30:45.34 – 00:30:50.56

makes somebody laugh or makes them think or inspires them. And this show does all of those

00:30:50.56 – 00:30:55.58

things. And of course, leave a nice five-star review. We appreciate all of that. We know you're

00:30:55.58 – 00:31:02.14

doing it because our numbers are way up. Tim Zinrono. Hi, Tim. How are you? Hi, Dave. Thanks

00:31:02.14 – 00:31:08.20

for taking my call. Sure. What's up? So my wife and I are about halfway through baby step three.

00:31:08.20 – 00:31:16.30

And so we're looking toward investing something that's outside of my work TSP and her work 401k.

00:31:16.76 – 00:31:25.28

Good. And we've reached out to a financial planner and I don't want to make another mistake with

00:31:25.28 – 00:31:30.34

money because I've done a lot of them. So I'm just wondering, how much should I be paying this guy

00:31:30.34 – 00:31:35.44

as a financial planning fee? And then... Did you go to a smart investor pro? We did. Okay.

00:31:36.32 – 00:31:42.14

We did. The smart investor pro, that particular one has a financial planning fee?

00:31:43.28 – 00:31:50.78

Yeah. They have a... They call it a retirement planning fee. It's an annual fee. And then

00:31:50.78 – 00:31:55.66

there's... Then as I was reading in there, depending on what investment vehicle you're

00:31:55.66 – 00:32:01.96

using, if it's like above 50,000, then it's a percentage. And then below that, it's the brokerage

00:32:01.96 – 00:32:09.70

fees was the way I was reading it. But I don't understand that. And we're meeting with the guy

00:32:09.70 – 00:32:17.24

tomorrow and I just... Most of the smart investor pros run on just managed accounts. And managed

00:32:17.24 – 00:32:23.62

accounts is simple. There's no commissions and they charge 1% of the balance. Now, some of them

00:32:23.62 – 00:32:30.66

do have a minimum, 50,000 in balance or whatever, till they get there. And you don't need to pay an

00:32:30.66 – 00:32:37.14

annual fee. I don't know what that's for, just for planning. Because you're not going to be doing

00:32:37.14 – 00:32:41.46

that much planning annually. Now, you may want to pay an upfront fee to help you get your will

00:32:41.46 – 00:32:46.82

started if you don't have one, help you do some other financial planning things. How much was that

00:32:46.82 – 00:32:53.50

fee? 600. Okay. That's not unreasonable now. Okay. Okay. All right. Because I mean, a lot of people

00:32:54.06 – 00:33:00.26

in the financial planning world, there are people that do not sell anything. They do not sell

00:33:00.26 – 00:33:05.26

insurance. They don't sell mutual funds. They don't sell wills. They don't sell anything. And

00:33:05.26 – 00:33:12.06

they just charge for their hours. That's called fee-based planning. Okay. I don't generally

00:33:12.06 – 00:33:17.60

recommend those because then you're also going to pay commissions on top of that. And you can get

00:33:17.60 – 00:33:26.46

the same advice basically for 600 instead of 4,000. Or for, you know, if you move a couple

00:33:26.46 – 00:33:30.66

hundred thousand bucks over there, you're not going to pay anything but 1%. And they're just

00:33:30.66 – 00:33:34.32

going to take care of your plan, your annual planning and your other stuff too. There's not

00:33:34.32 – 00:33:39.88

that much to this. And so different Smart Investor Pros run different things. But as to my knowledge,

00:33:39.94 – 00:33:46.30

we don't have any fee only. All of them are managing mutual funds for your Roth IRA, your

00:33:46.30 – 00:33:52.42

college or rollover from your old job or whatever. And they're helping you do that. And 1% on the

00:33:52.42 – 00:33:58.16

managed accounts is what almost all of them are doing. I mean, my only question would be at this

00:33:58.16 – 00:34:02.36

point in your investing, you haven't even begun yet. How much financial planning do you need each

00:34:02.36 – 00:34:10.22

year? That would be my question. Right. Not a ton, but 600 bucks is not, you know, it's not 6,000.

00:34:10.22 – 00:34:17.60

That's true. The other thing you can do is this, meet with that guy and just get a sense of the

00:34:17.60 – 00:34:28.50

spirit. And as you're driving away, ask your wife, do not ask her what she thinks. Ask her how she

00:34:28.50 – 00:34:35.36

feels about that meeting. The reason I'm calling is based on how she feels. Okay. What's her

00:34:35.36 – 00:34:41.06

feeling? Well, they sent us their disclosure agreement and the contract. She started reading

00:34:41.06 – 00:34:44.44

the contract and she's like, well, wait a minute. Now we're getting tied into a contract and there's

00:34:44.44 – 00:34:49.24

all these different fees and whatnot and getting nickel and dime to death. And I don't want to get

00:34:49.24 – 00:34:54.70

involved in that. Okay. Go meet with them and see if that spirit changes. We have, we've met with

00:34:54.70 – 00:34:59.52

them twice already. Oh, okay. Okay. Then don't do it. Okay. You're interviewing them. Yeah. Click

00:34:59.52 – 00:35:04.04

on Smart Investor Pro and go talk to another one. Okay. There's more than one in your area.

00:35:04.04 – 00:35:10.84

And you know, there's probably one just doing a 1% management fee. Um, and so that, that really

00:35:10.84 – 00:35:16.68

wouldn't be that unusual. So yeah, listen, dude, a hundred percent of the time, my wife does not

00:35:16.68 – 00:35:25.12

feel good about a business relationship I'm entering into. We don't do it period, period.

00:35:25.74 – 00:35:30.72

And I will ask her, I'll challenge her. Are you sure that's God's spirit? Not last night's pizza,

00:35:31.36 – 00:35:37.26

right? I'm going to double check, but she will say, nah, it just doesn't feel right. And every

00:35:37.26 – 00:35:43.04

time that one wins, Proverbs 31, who can find a virtuous wife, the heart of her husband safely

00:35:43.04 – 00:35:52.76

trusts her and he will have no lack of gain. Huh? Look at that. So yeah, don't, don't do it. I don't

00:35:52.76 – 00:35:59.58

care if it's our, the guy might not be a bad guy, but he's not your guy. And that's it. That's

00:35:59.58 – 00:36:03.78

because somebody else might call the guy, work with him and be like, this guy's great. How many,

00:36:03.92 – 00:36:07.24

there's been many times where somebody has recommended somebody to me, they love them.

00:36:07.52 – 00:36:10.54

And then I go and I'm like, that's not my guy. Yeah. So it happens.

00:36:10.74 – 00:36:14.34

Hey Christian, I do want to learn a little bit more about this guy. I don't think he's doing

00:36:14.34 – 00:36:17.38

anything wrong, but I want to learn a little bit about him. So find out who it was. Okay. I'm

00:36:17.38 – 00:36:24.82

gonna put them on hold. All right. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Tom is with us in San Diego. Hey,

00:36:24.84 – 00:36:29.56

Tom, how are you? Hey Dave, I'm good. How are you guys? Better than we deserve. What's up?

00:36:30.62 – 00:36:36.50

Wonderful. Glad to hear it. Um, I am out here and I'm trying to figure out what the right move is

00:36:36.50 – 00:36:43.10

to do with my house. So I went through FPU, uh, at the beginning of the year and I'm upside down

00:36:44.28 – 00:36:50.48

on the car payments. Like I make good money, but I'm, I'm at a very high in debt to income

00:36:50.48 – 00:36:55.36

threshold on my, on my house payment. How much is your house payment?

00:36:56.96 – 00:36:59.58

$4,500. And what do you bring home?

00:37:01.28 – 00:37:05.64

Uh, gross is about $140, $145. What are you bringing home a month? Every month.

00:37:06.92 – 00:37:13.46

Just over $11,000. Yeah, that's pretty high. Okay. Yeah. And how much is your car payment?

00:37:15.24 – 00:37:22.26

$860,000. Holy. Well, there is a bigger problem. Yep. And that's, so this is the problem I faced.

00:37:22.26 – 00:37:27.88

I'm all about the dumps of Tahoe plan, but because I'm too upside down on it, there's no way.

00:37:28.44 – 00:37:39.20

What do you owe? I got hit really hard. 30, number 30, 39. Okay. And what do you think it's worth?

00:37:40.78 – 00:37:46.36

Well, according to the like KBB estimates, it books at like 24. Private sale?

00:37:47.88 – 00:37:54.74

Private. And so trade would be like 20. Yeah. What'd you do? Tear it up? No. Roll negative

00:37:54.74 – 00:38:01.42

equity from the other deal in it? Negative. No, I didn't. Um, it was a, it's a high interest.

00:38:03.10 – 00:38:06.62

Oh, wait a minute. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. What's your interest rate?

00:38:08.26 – 00:38:15.88

12. Okay. The 40 or the 39 is probably not your payoff. That's probably when you do a subprime

00:38:15.88 – 00:38:20.84

loan. They generally put it on the books on TOP total of all payments. That's different than an

00:38:20.84 – 00:38:26.82

early payoff number. You're asking for you. Did you ask what your account balance is and you got

00:38:26.82 – 00:38:32.08

39? No, I asked them what their pay of the 10 day payoff. And they gave me a 20 day payoff,

00:38:32.18 – 00:38:38.16

which I've never heard of, but. Okay. So that's an actual payoff number. That was an actual payoff

00:38:38.16 – 00:38:47.38

number. What car is this? It was a Jeep. Man, you got so screwed. Okay. So the, I'm, I'm really

00:38:47.38 – 00:38:52.70

close to a breakthrough on being able to refinance this house and it would cut my payment down

00:38:52.70 – 00:38:58.16

significantly. But the trouble is because I have this, like I'm trying to go back and forth between

00:38:58.16 – 00:39:03.90

baby steps one and two. And so I had my step one, I'm crushing step two. And then I got hit with

00:39:03.90 – 00:39:09.64

like $20,000 of home repairs in June. And so I just got nothing. So it's starting all over.

00:39:10.26 – 00:39:14.70

And so I just keep getting overwhelmed with it and trying to figure out how I should do it. Cause

00:39:14.70 – 00:39:21.02

if I give up everything, I'll do it. Yeah. I mean, something's got to go and you need to decide what

00:39:21.02 – 00:39:25.78

it is because nothing you're describing is fun. We got to get rid of the Jeep and maybe the car,

00:39:25.86 – 00:39:31.42

maybe the house you decide, but you can get more of both. So I wouldn't hang on to them for dear

00:39:31.42 – 00:39:38.02

life. I just say, okay, God, which get me out of this. Hey folks, Dave here. And I know some of

00:39:38.02 – 00:39:42.90

you listen to the show, waiting for a call that answers your specific question. Maybe you need

00:39:42.90 – 00:39:48.32

help with budgeting or investing or saving your emergency fund, but wouldn't it be great if you

00:39:48.32 – 00:39:53.80

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in the app store today. Live from the headquarters of Ramsey solutions, it's the Ramsey show,

00:40:41.88 – 00:40:49.68

where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing

00:40:50.30 – 00:40:54.80

relationships. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. Number one bestselling author, Jade Warshall,

00:40:54.92 – 00:41:03.34

Ramsey personality is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Craig is with us in

00:41:03.34 – 00:41:09.02

Minneapolis. Hi, Craig. How are you? Great. How are you? Better than I deserve. What's up?

00:41:10.46 – 00:41:16.64

So to start off with, we have no debt outside of what we owe on the home. But my question is,

00:41:16.64 – 00:41:24.34

is investing money into solar panels to save money on utilities better or worse than investing in

00:41:24.34 – 00:41:31.62

the market? So after the tax credit that you'd get the 30% that just comes right off, I'd get

00:41:31.62 – 00:41:38.00

it back on next year's taxes. That equates to about a 7.8% return on what I would save. So

00:41:38.00 – 00:41:43.04

obviously, I don't have to pay tax on money that I saved. But if I invested it, I end up having to

00:41:43.04 – 00:41:50.14

pay tax eventually on money that's invested. Man, you really want some solar panels, don't you?

00:41:52.54 – 00:42:02.26

You got the bug. You got the salesman's pitch down, man. So what you're saying is actually not

00:42:02.26 – 00:42:08.38

true. Because if you put it into a Roth, there's no taxes on it. And a tax rebate is just a cost

00:42:08.38 – 00:42:14.04

savings. It's not a return on investment. Right. I'm not factoring in the tax

00:42:14.04 – 00:42:19.78

rebate on anything as far as... You said a 7% rate of return was the tax credit.

00:42:20.96 – 00:42:31.24

Oh, no, no, no, no, no. So the system is like 57. I'd get the 17 or whatever back on the tax

00:42:31.24 – 00:42:36.08

credit. So I'm looking at it... That tax credit is just a cost savings. That's all it is.

00:42:36.66 – 00:42:41.48

It's not a return on investment. And I'm not factoring that into any of my figures.

00:42:41.50 – 00:42:50.70

What was your 7.6%? Me eventually putting in $40,000 and saving about $3,400 a year.

00:42:52.04 – 00:42:58.68

Oh, okay. All right. That's your 7%. Okay. That is an actual return. Okay. All right. Correct.

00:42:58.68 – 00:43:06.08

So if you invest $40,000, you have a 10-year breakeven.

00:43:07.84 – 00:43:14.22

About, yeah. Yeah. That's because you're not in the solar panel zone in Minneapolis. You ought

00:43:14.22 – 00:43:18.44

to have about a five-year breakeven on solar panels for them to make sense. And the reason

00:43:18.44 – 00:43:26.12

is the technology is moving so quickly. The solar panels today are excellent compared to five years

00:43:26.12 – 00:43:30.80

ago. And the solar panels five years from now will be excellent compared to that junk you're

00:43:30.80 – 00:43:36.40

getting ready to buy. So you need to break even on it really quick. It's like buying a computer.

00:43:38.00 – 00:43:45.54

Think about a five-year-old computer. It's a joke. It's a doorstop. And so nothing as clunky

00:43:45.54 – 00:43:51.06

as old solar panels. But I'm a believer in solar, but solar, the numbers we've run on it, you need

00:43:51.06 – 00:43:58.02

to try to break even on it. Net cost, not the 57, but the 40. I'll go with your tax credit being a

00:43:58.02 – 00:44:04.32

cost savings. So we're running the numbers on 40. But if you're only making 3,400 on 40, you've got

00:44:04.32 – 00:44:10.70

a 10-year breakeven, 11, 12-year breakeven. That's not good enough. You need to make your money back

00:44:10.70 – 00:44:15.44

faster than that on that kind of thing. So I endorse solar companies in some of the markets

00:44:15.44 – 00:44:20.12

that we're in, some of the talk radio stations and so forth, but they're running five, maybe

00:44:20.12 – 00:44:27.38

seven-year breakevens, but not 10, 12. And by the way, 7% rate of return on technology that's

00:44:27.38 – 00:44:33.86

deteriorating daily is not a great rate of return. So 7% rate of return on a high-yield

00:44:33.86 – 00:44:40.14

savings account would be great, but it's not great on technology. So that's going down. So

00:44:40.70 – 00:44:46.36

these guys, and you've obviously run into a world-class salesman because you're regurgitating

00:44:46.36 – 00:44:55.24

his stuff really well. No, I personally would not do that. I just want to make sure. Because

00:44:55.24 – 00:45:00.60

your breakeven is too long. I just want to make sure he wasn't thinking about this as an alternative

00:45:01.04 – 00:45:05.44

to... He was, and that's the other problem. It's not even on the same spectrum of investing. Just

00:45:05.44 – 00:45:11.50

do your investing and then say, am I going to buy something else that gives me a breakeven? Am I

00:45:11.50 – 00:45:16.38

going to buy a car that saves me on gas mileage? Yeah, they're two separate discussions. Okay,

00:45:16.38 – 00:45:21.74

if I've got a gas guzzler and I'm going to save X number of dollars on my car by buying it, but

00:45:21.74 – 00:45:25.32

it's a little bit more expensive. What's the breakeven on your gas mileage savings? But that

00:45:25.32 – 00:45:28.60

has nothing to do with whether or not you're going to invest. That's not an alternative to investing.

00:45:28.64 – 00:45:31.44

Yeah, that's right. You don't get to not do a Roth because you bought a car that doesn't

00:45:31.44 – 00:45:35.38

need gas. That's right. Or you put solar panels up that don't need electricity. But what that tells

00:45:35.38 – 00:45:41.04

us is he can't afford to do this because he's considering doing one over the other.

00:45:42.70 – 00:45:47.04

That's what I'm getting to. I got my magnifying glass out. Good, good,

00:45:47.06 – 00:45:51.94

good job there, investigative. I like it. Cody's in Orlando. Hey, Cody, what's up?

00:45:53.38 – 00:46:00.74

Hey, Dave. So I am over my head in a situation with a car that I financed.

00:46:02.02 – 00:46:09.10

I took the car over and now I'm in a position where my mechanic told me that the motors are

00:46:09.10 – 00:46:15.60

in recall. It's destined to blow up at any point. Of course it is. And I owe $14,000 on this car.

00:46:17.20 – 00:46:22.64

And there is about a two-year waiting list for a new motor due to the recall on all of them.

00:46:22.80 – 00:46:27.34

What vehicle is it? What is it? It's a 2018 Hyundai Sonata.

00:46:28.98 – 00:46:35.64

And Sonata's all the engines are blowing? It's burning oil, causing the engines to blow up.

00:46:35.68 – 00:46:40.20

It's internally burning oil. And it's a recall. This is not just you. It is,

00:46:40.42 – 00:46:45.00

but it is not covered. I'm not under warranty due to the mileage on the car.

00:46:46.82 – 00:46:52.96

And so the car is at almost 160,000 miles. I took it over in a bad situation going through a divorce,

00:46:53.14 – 00:46:57.26

didn't want the credit to get ruined, took over the car. Okay, so what are you

00:46:57.26 – 00:47:02.80

on it? I owe $14,000. And what can you sell this piece of crap for?

00:47:04.06 – 00:47:10.74

A trade-in, probably $2,000. And I don't have anything in savings, but I have another car.

00:47:10.86 – 00:47:16.38

My mom just passed away and I inherited her car. No payment, paid off. What's it worth?

00:47:16.68 – 00:47:23.16

About $3,000 trade-in. It's a little older. It's a 2012 with about 80,000 miles on it.

00:47:26.02 – 00:47:27.66

About $54,000 a year.

00:47:29.86 – 00:47:37.26

All right. So if you trade-in or whatever, you got $3,000, you need $11,000, right?

00:47:38.70 – 00:47:43.70

Yes. Where are you going to get $11,000? You need $11,000, where are you going to get it?

00:47:44.54 – 00:47:46.38

Yeah, I don't have it. I know. Where are you going to get it?

00:47:47.54 – 00:47:50.26

I would have to work and save it. That's right.

00:47:50.36 – 00:47:52.44

Like a lot of work, more than you're doing now. Yeah.

00:47:52.80 – 00:47:55.48

Like extra job. Yeah. Okay.

00:47:55.60 – 00:48:00.14

Like you can make, you know, $1,500, $2,000 a month delivering pizza

00:48:01.42 – 00:48:02.64

five nights a week. Okay.

00:48:02.74 – 00:48:05.78

And you're doing that in your mom's old car, or you could run the Sonata all the way into

00:48:05.78 – 00:48:08.90

the ground until it blows. I don't care because it's not going to be any more. You might as well

00:48:08.90 – 00:48:15.74

get something out of it and just run the crap out of it and, you know, DoorDash and pizza and

00:48:15.74 – 00:48:20.60

anything else. What do you do for a living? Right now I'm a cook at Longhorn.

00:48:20.60 – 00:48:27.62

Okay. All right. So anything you could do to get more and more hours at the best possible pay

00:48:27.62 – 00:48:32.36

doing anything, I want you working like a maniac and, you know, like have a, like a, I don't know,

00:48:32.42 – 00:48:36.10

five, six month plan to be done with it. Five months would be $2,000 a month, right?

00:48:37.26 – 00:48:37.76

Yes, sir.

00:48:37.96 – 00:48:40.82

Find $2,000 a month for five months and then get rid of this piece of crap.

00:48:41.68 – 00:48:46.50

And then you go, okay, that one's in my rear view mirror. No pun intended.

00:48:47.10 – 00:48:48.84

I think he thought there was a...

00:48:49.58 – 00:48:51.10

Oh, there's not a hack.

00:48:51.24 – 00:48:52.26

Yeah, there is a hack.

00:48:52.42 – 00:48:53.14

No, there's not a hack.

00:48:53.42 – 00:48:55.44

Gotta work your way out, unfortunately.

00:48:55.82 – 00:49:01.24

It is. It's called work. Lots of work. It's a hack.

00:49:02.10 – 00:49:02.96

Magic trick.

00:49:04.16 – 00:49:10.56

Work all the time. It's a hack. Oh, this is a Ramsey show.

00:49:13.54 – 00:49:18.50

Hey guys, it's Rachel Cruz here to tell you about a faith-based alternative to health insurance

00:49:18.50 – 00:49:22.36

that can make healthcare more affordable, Christian Healthcare Ministries.

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