Claire Danes

Yes, I can tell that we are gonna be friends. Hey there, welcome to yet another episode, a thrilling episode of Conan O'Brien needs a friend. Joined by my loyal gang, my chums, my comrades. Sona Momsesian Hi, good to see you. good to see you.

I'm noticing that that's good. And Mr. Matt? Gorley Matt, how are you? Hi, good to see you. Your citizenship classes are going very well.

I love America, it's a beautiful country I can turn right at a red light.

I am just back, I'm feeling good because I just got back from a lengthy stay in New York City. Yeah, did a bunch of podcast records there, very cool. And what we do is we sort of get some of the people that don't often get to this coast.

Our great booker Paula Davis lined up just a murderer's row of people to talk to. I'm sorry, what? So many of those people come out to Los Angeles regularly, many of them live here.

Many of them live here, and it's like you caught them when they were in New York, so don't do that. Yeah, it's brutal. Well, first of all, you do have a point there that every single person I talk to not only regularly comes to Los Angeles. But of the, I think seven people I interviewed during my week, I think six of them own homes within 300 feet of this building.

I mean, that's the part that's really hard to swallow. Yeah, it is, it is. No, it's true. Let's see.

We talk to a lot of people and I do say, I will say this. There are some interviews where I think I really miss you guys, there are some interviews. I'm sorry I lock in. I'm having such a blast. Do I miss you? No, oh.

That's going to happen occasionally. I'll say I talked to seven people last week and I know you guys were very jealous that I talked to. Matthew Rhys. Yes, you're big Matthew Rhys fans. I don't know if this is going to console you or not, but as amazing as he was on Zoom in person, multiply that by 1,000..

What's he smell like? He smells like Victory and pine like if you could take the pine scent, plus just the smell of victory. Oh my God, so like if you built a log cabin out of the assault on Omaha Beach.

Yes, exactly, yeah, that's a reference to D-day. Yes, I know it is, I just wouldn't know.

You probably think we attacked a beach in Omaha, Nebraska. Okay, real funny, but you know what? That probably smelled a lot like death, so I don't think that it was probably a good example. No coast of France.

Nice, briny, smell, beautiful. I understand you're going a little hard at him, but you kind of came a little hard at me. I'm sorry.

I'm sorry, that's true. It's weird when you two fight. Yeah, we have to have a United front here because he's the one screwing us, I know.

He went off to New York first, I went to New York, and you know what, it's incredible, you know what's incredible? I looked at my....

I was wearing an Apple watch. Ooh, an aristocrat.

When you're in New York and I'm just walking around doing things. And one day I did 10 miles. And then I think here in Los Angeles, I get in my car, I come here to the podcast studio and then this is my choice. I'm carried by my assistant David up and placed in my chair, and then I'm carried back to my car and I go home. And then this is a deal I have with my wife, where I'm carried upstairs. Okay, and so I barely move here in L.A. But I got so much. I was just walking and walking and I have killer abs right now, my ass is rock hard.

Let's see it. Do you want to see my ass? Yeah, No, I'm good. Wait, your birthday's coming up.

I'll make sure.

It's five o'clock tomorrow morning. Ass pick text.

Happy birthday, you're like, What is this? happy on one cheek? birthday on the other? Why did someone send me a picture of these two soggy, uncooked English muffins?

Oh, no, wait, oh wait a minute.

Why are they freckled English muffins?

Okay, that's my ass, ladies. Two. They've been soaked in brine and then just taken out. They were never put through a toaster brine.

And they smell like that, they have little freckles.

Yeah, and then, of course, that tattoo we won't talk about that, it's of an Apple Watch.

Yeah, it is amazing, it was incredible, but I did miss you guys. Sincerely, I did miss you. But I think the interviews were really terrific and in no way hampered by your absence. But I also missed you.

And I think it was a great loss. But at the same time, I think, if anything, the interviews were enhanced, but I think the quality really suffered. There. I've covered all my bases. You can walk in L.A.

I'm just saying, you know, I mean, I have a very like, not love-hate. I don't know what it is with New York City. And I mean, anytime someone says, you could do this in New York, you could do that here too. You just walk somewhere else.

Yeah, oh, wait a minute. Okay, not really true, because I've tried taking walks like my dream is to be able to ride my bike.

I did get to talk to one guest who rides their bike everywhere all through New York City. It's a surprise guest and it's a big deal. You got a doordash delivery person on the podcast.

Yes, wow, we didn't have anyone that day, so I ordered a caesar salad.

No, I would love to be able to ride my bike. It's very hard to do that in L.A. from, say, where I live to here, because I live 175 miles away from the studio, but that's on me. But it is hard also to walk in L.A. Sometimes you're trying to walk someplace and the sidewalk just stops.

That doesn't happen in New York City. The sidewalk doesn't just stop anywhere, but you don't have to stop, you can keep walking into the street. Are you worried?

Oh, yeah, you can. Oh sure, you can. yeah. And then you're immediately hit by a truck. I've been hit by trucks 15 times.

Yeah, yeah, well, I don't think is New York really a safe place to ride a bike? because I've opened my door and hit a bike.

Well, it's not safe. Clearly, when you're opening doors, you're supposed to check Sona. So when you're kicking a door open and saying death to all bikers and they go flying over the door, then no, it's not a good place to hang. Not at all.

But yeah, is it safe to bike? I don't think it's safe to bike. Yes, there's a lot. It's much better because there are a lot of bike lanes.

Okay, what you have to watch out for is many more people have electric bikes. Oh, and there are a lot of delivery people and they're going 140 miles an hour.

Yes, and they've strapped sharp knives to the front of their bikes. It's like road warrior. Yeah, it's like road warrior. That's a little tricky.

Yeah, but I would love to be able to ride my bike to work. The only way I could do it is if I bought a really big pickup truck and just did little figure eights in the back on my bike. While someone drove you, Sona, while you drove me to work.

Oh, okay, all right, sure. I won't break suddenly and for reasons I don't understand. While I'm taking these tight circles, I go whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop.

Whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop. That three stooges curly noise the whole time I'm spinning around all right. Well, very happy about this.

My guest today is an Emmy award-winning actress who starred as CIA agent Carrie Mathison for eight seasons of the Showtime series Homeland. That is an iconic show. Now you can see her in the Fantastic Hulu series. I loved this. Fleischman is in trouble.

I am thrilled, absolutely thrilled and delighted that she's here today.

Claire, danes welcome.

Cause I, you've all. I mean, like, you have done so well, and then I have this weird pride, which is misplaced. Because I've had nothing to do with your life, I've done nothing other than have you on the show a couple of times, so I've in no way contributed to your success. But I still have this kind of weird, quasi paternal thing that I don't quite understand.

And I was like, Yes, yes, I do. I know many people and that may have sealed the deal for me. That may have, like, gotten me my wife of 21 years. So good for you.

You know, what do we call them now?

You're effervescent and fun and and a great laugher, and I think, man, she's a good actress.

And yeah, it's, you know, it's taxing and risky to venture into those dark crevices of the human experience. But I so believed in the thing and was so excited to have a chance to, you know, explore these themes and and these experiences that are so under represented in pop culture. Um, that, uh, you know, I. I felt really invested and able to do it, and there's even some kind of joy in it. I mean, I I think, because I know it's in service, potentially of something worthwhile, you know, like, I mean, sometimes it's much harder to do a kind of technically easy scene with wonky writing than a really exacting, demanding scene with excellent writing. Like it carries you.

You know, we are talking about this during this writer's strike, and it's appropriate to bring up like here.

I would need to be talking about method, yeah, I would need someone to be hitting me with hammers. Yeah, no, it's true, I mean.

And I guess I was asked about this. Like, how it's possible for me to move sort of fluidly in and out of complex feeling and then kind of be intact as a human. On set, minutes later. And Jennifer Garner actually reminded me that she had worked with, Um, the producing director of my so-called life, shortly after. We had done that series. And I was 13 when I did the pilot, 14 when I did the show. And she was, uh, Scott Wynette is is the director's name.

And she said that he was talking about working with me and he had a great time and, you know, was very impressed and all that. But you know that I was, I would get lost in in those darker scenes and it was hard for me to surface. And I'd kind of forgotten that. I was like, Oh yeah, I was just learning, you know?

And I, I guess I take for granted the technique that I've just developed over time that I'm very grateful for. I mean, I can't say that I'm like, fully in command of it constantly. It's a little deceptive, I mean, sometimes people will say, how can you just be laughing in between takes? And it's like, it's a little misleading. Because, yeah, I, I have a certain amount of control, but it's always like on a bit of a simmer inside.

It's just not obviously visible to anybody else.

It was, but anyway, so yes, it was a funny way to live, and and very permissive in a lot of, in a lot of ways. But nobody, you know, nobody around me, was involved with the performing arts. And actually, it was only until I did that show. Finding your roots when I learned that. My paternal grandmother, who I never knew and actually died when my dad was 10. And her name is Claire Danes, named after like, she apparently got a master's in the role of dance and Shakespearean drama and had acted and directed in plays. And and I was kind of stunned by that, because there was no indication of of this being anywhere in the gene pool.

There must be a picture somewhere of a guy with like puffy hair who's making an ass of himself and being chased by angry people. But I heard that you early on, you were interested in mimicking. Is that true? Yeah.

I am still a terrible napper, but I'm also totally obsequious, like people, pleasing person, which I, you know, still am. So anyway. So I wanted to convince her that I was sleeping and I was doing my best impression of a sleeping a tiny child. And I, I'd. I'd remembered that my mom had twitched in her sleep and so I was doing this. I was trying to do this twitch and I thought, Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's good.

That's really subtle, that's super nuanced. She's never going to know that I am not unconscious.

Let's go three times around the park and I want to, No.

And I just started kind of hustling. Like, I found this Junior Arts, a Junior U.M. Junior High School for Performing Arts program. And I went to Lee Strasberg and I went to H.B. Studios. But this was all my by my own making, and they didn't interfere, but, you know, and but, and they were generally supportive. But I would just rollerblade from audition to audition, you know, I would like get some jobs in. That eventually materialized into a career, to all of our total astonishment.

Yeah, and then we were on a plane. Um, my brother is seven years older, so he was at college at this point and we kind of had the latitude to do that. My dad's business was, he was a contractor that was naturally ending, and um, we were available to this experience.

Thank goodness, like together as a unit, um, but we were deposited in L.A. It was like the day after that massive earthquake in 94, and so there were actual aftershock like the ground was shaking, which is just an absurd.

We didn't even know how to, like, pretend, you know, that that was.

And so we were always doing things like that, so kids were always around. And I so often remember them coming up to me as if they'd been hit with cattle prods. And they would say, Mr O'Brien, I wish to tell you that you have transformed late night and you have made a generational impact.

And I'd look behind them and see the parent staring at them, like, we practiced this all night. It's this bullshit, you go say to Colonel Kraken, and I would feel terrible, you feel terrible about it.

They all went on to be very famous. That was Ben Affleck, anyway. No, I'm kidding, but it was just incredible that.

I think it's the exception that proves the rule. And I think the fact that you were very nuanced, you were thoughtful and your parents were thoughtful. And then you decide, I need to get an education.

And I think I was, I got a little, I did get a little dizzy and overwhelmed at a certain point. Um, and was being given a lot of opportunity and didn't quite know how to channel that focus. It. You know, you know, I didn't have a filter yet that I kind of needed to establish, um, in a safer place. Like, uh, you know, a campus. And I was a little lonely, you know, I I mean, initially, I was so relieved to be jettisoned out of the hell of junior high and and high school.

But I also was just like, very sensitive to the injustices that were often on display. And and and couldn't help. But I don't know, um, kind of take the bait and and I don't know the the politics made me insane, the social politics. I wasn't strictly bullied, but I was, I was vulnerable and I was also I really liked learning. You know, I was nerdy and kind of didn't get the memo. That you're supposed to pretend that you're not so engaged and curious at a certain point as a girl.

I've I. My son now is 10 and so he's starting to enter that point and he is. He's such a wonderful, tender, clever goofball, like he's, but and I see all of his kind of vulnerability. And. But it's funny, cause I'm a mom from the school texted me about her son being aware of some bullying that was happening in his grade. And but Cyrus is just sort of like, oblivious or or just not very moved by it, you know, and and and her son was, you know?

And and I was like, Oh gosh, I, I was your son, you know, and I'm so grateful that my son isn't.

Yeah, I still keep saying to Justin, I, you know, I I'm glad. you know, I'm glad he's here. I really am. I'm glad he's here. I can't imagine, uh, him not being here, but uh, he, he showed up so late and um.

What slight gap then Bain's born in 67, and then some, you know, then there's a long gap, and then I think Justin shows up in the early seventies.

And so there's a 10 year gap between Justin and I. And I remembered someone saying, What a wonderful. Later on. It was about five, 10 years ago. Someone said to me in front of my father, Um, isn't it wonderful that your youngest was born? Your your youngest brother was born so much later because all of you could help nurture and raise him? And I said, What are you talking about? It's like they threw a brand new tire into the ape cage and we just tore him apart. We really did, we really just did start throwing him around.

It toughened him up, it toughened him up, but no, there was not a lot of careful nurturing of this poor guy.

Cause, you know what, Father's Day is a total crock. We get nothing, no one believes in it. No, no.

And you know what?

And then, Um, yeah, I think I deserve nothing.

No, he, he, he, he takes on a kind of disproportionate amount of the parental duties. So I I, Um, big shout out to Hugh Dancy, who's pretty wonderful.

And, um, not being at all sympathetic to your character. And then there's this thing, and again, I don't want to give anything away. But there's this scene that, uh, where your character Rachel, goes to this yoga retreat. And these emotions are being drawn out of you in this scene. And you, there's this kind of whale breakdown that you have. That, like, came through the TV set and slapped me around in a way that is, this is a compliment. I don't like being. I'm not into. I'm not into that, by the way, Claire, Not into that. I'm sick of that rumor that I like being slapped about.

Um, a whipping occasionally, but no, uh, I felt like you had reached to the TV and it was so. And then, of course, I start talking to my friends who are also watching the show. And we're all talking about that scene, and I think that scene is the most striking moment I had in television in memory. It just was like, Oh my god, it completely turned me around on your character in a moment. But also I walked away from that thinking, I do not understand. I know that there are great actors in the world.

I do not know how Claire Danes was able to do that, I do not know how you were able to do that scene well.

But so both are at play. And really, when the camera's rolling, you have to just, you know, be in a non-thinking space and an emotive space. But I and I, yeah, I, I, I see myself here myself, not like taking. Maybe it sounds like I'm not taking credit for my contributions, but I can't do that so freely if I don't feel held by the people that I'm working with. And John and Val, who were the directors on the episodes, that I was doing the heavy lifting.

You know, they were, they were just so.

Now try one where you're the murder victim, like, you're changing massive thing. Do you know what I mean?

I think it's improv, and then one person said, it might help your. I started doing improv a lot, and someone said you should take a serious acting class. So I took one downtown and I don't remember which one it was, but it was like a Stella Adler serious class. And I went in and signed up and paid.

I think it was about 23 24.

And there was a they asked me at one point to do a scene where I get up with another woman. And I tell her how much I love her and how much she means to me and how heartbroken I am. And I said, I can do this if it is in the purpose of being funny, like if there's a joke to it, I can, actually, that would be.

The only way that I could act, I think, in any kind of it was if it ends, if it's going in the purpose of a joke, right? Or if it ends in a so interesting, I know, and now you're my therapist, but but, but I, but I'm serious.

Like I do, I have done sketches where I'm looking at myself, saying, I think I'm kind of acting here. But I. It's because I know that it's in the service of a joke. And to me, that's my. That's my wooden barrel. I can go over Niagara Falls, but I needed my and to be in my wooden barrel of. It's comedy, whereas what you're doing, there's you're going over the falls, there is no barrel.

It's so naked and I find that terrifying. I'm in awe of it, but I just find it it's terrifying. Yeah, well.

It'd be great if I talked you into something, you know, no, I need a sitcom. Well.

And it was kind, it was just it's open space, and it was a great place to throw costume parties at. A swing. Oh, my parents had a swing, they had a swing, they had a trampoline, they had a trapeze. I mean, my mom also ran a toddler school, but this was even before she had the they just like.

Like, it's this kind of long and narrow townhouse with it's very with many stairs and stuff, but there isn't this, like it's not a dance party venue.

And I got weepy.

There's some he went to, like boarding school, and I guess, was just kind of inhaled these biblical stories. So I'm at, you know, it was just like swimming in the water.

I don't know. It was great, there were a lot of playboy bunnies, you could be. It was secular and religious, yes.

But people are, you know?

And then suddenly I have, like, a 19th century Irish accent, like, Oh, what is this asshole doing? Like? I had a nice way for duckling.

And the minute you give me a pipe, it's bits left and right, and um, but it's. It's just childish, it's child's play, but it's really fun.

I am, I am proud of this. Like, I'm like, I knew her when she was a child. And people say, sit down, old man, but, uh, it is. Uh, it's a thrill to see you.

Okay, well, this is where we get to judge their judgment of us. Essentially, although this one is a bit more of a uh, I, what would I call it like?

I got a an ax to grind. Oh good, yeah, all right, this is from Shmoopy.

It's five star review, and this is just representative of many comments we've gotten all right. A while back, we did an episode of Conan O'Brien needs a fan episode where I mentioned Ink, a dink, a bottle of ink.

And you all looked at me like, I was crazy. Yep, yeah, well, people are coming out of the woodwork to defend me. Oh good.

That's nice, it's nice to know, and you know what, if anyone should defend you? It's shmoopy.

It's not often you hear Shmoopy to the rescue. Uh, well, also terry bagels and give him well, and No man is an island. Freaky Fritz and Sean the Bomb, Oh, seven, Yep.

Yep, you stand, so here's one of those. Are your apostles? You're quite the religious leader. Matt is right.

We did this every time we played Hide and Seek or Ghost in the Graveyard to see who was it. We actually had one more verse to it as well. Ink a dink, a bottle of ink, the cork fill out and you stink. Not because you're dirty, not because you're clean, just because you kissed a girl behind a magazine.

Love your podcast, love the chill chums, and Conan is okay, too. Oh, behind a magazine, yeah.

I don't want this person as a fan. That was not something I remember. Who says Time for our little sexual indiscretion? Meet me behind the magazine. What does that even mean?

And again, this is I live in Brookline. I lived in Brookline, Massachusetts, which is right up against Boston, so it's the closest town to Boston, really, where we would play a pickup game. And if there was any kind of dispute like that was a foul, you fouled him or no fair you, you interfered, whatever, any kind of, or no. You were out, you were out of bounds, cause you stepped over towards the Sizes lawn rather than staying on Canard Road.

Whenever people said stuff like that, if you wanted to passive aggressively tell the other side, Okay, you can have it. You'd say, let them have it, let the babies have their orange juice. I remember we all said that, I remember people, that was something people said just in our area.

And people took offense to that like they understood it was, they understood like, no, he really was out. No, it's fine, okay, okay.

Yeah, I was out. Let the babies have their orange juice, and I remember saying that with great conviction. And it's such a. And then, of course, living in different parts of the country, you try.

Nobody says that, okay, I thought you tried saying it to someone and they were like, No, it is, I'm sure I've said that.

I'm sure I have tried that in L.A. throughout my career, whether I was in New York or L.A. And someone said, No that you know, no, no, that skip. That joke doesn't belong in the sketch, it shouldn't be there. Okay, okay, let the baby have his orange juice.

And I'm sure people just said, Oh, what? First of all, orange juice is not something you give to a baby, it's way too high in sugar, way too acidic. Yeah, so it. The more I've learned about babies, the more I've realized that it doesn't even make sense.

The baby doesn't want the orange juice. Did you have an Apple Peaches pumpkin pie? Whoever's not ready? holler. I know I grew up in the 20th century. What, what was it?

This is a lot bubble gum, bubble gum. What's that one? Eduardo? bubble gum? bubble gum in a dish?

One for the money, two for the show, three to get ready. What's up my bro? What? I don't think it went, What's up my bro?

Yeah, I don't think you should ever say, What's up, my bro? The classic, right? Eeny Meeny, Miny Moe, yeah.

Catch a tiger by the toe if he hollers, let him pay. I know that one that goes back to the civil war, you know, but the ones they're saying, Do you know him?

No, you're a child of immigrants like I am, and this is real white. Which ones do you know? Eduardo Superman, Superman, fly away.

I know Superman, well, let's hear it, you're so tentative, that's it, what?

You're never going to make it in this country. Eduardo. If that's all you've got, yeah, superman, fly away, and what else have you got? that's it.

Get out of my country, USA, USA. Did you say no cuts, no butts, no coconuts when people would cut in line in front of you? I've heard it, I know that one.

I never said it, but I know that one. Okay, I don't know. that's what I know, there you go.

I'm American. These are the things that should be on the citizenship test when you enter the country. No, it should not. Oh, you're right, it shouldn't be.

No, no, it shouldn't be. No, we're doing a list of what shouldn't be on the citizenship test. Yeah, I know, yeah.

Like, let the baby have their orange juice. I think people can go in this world without knowing that. Maybe that's just a Boston thing, I don't know. That's a weird one.

It's really weird. Let the babies, and I remember saying it with great, you know, sort of intensity. Yeah, let the babies have their orange juice. We shall move on.

Wow, what a stupid thing to say. I was stupid. Yeah, yeah.

I mean, if we've, if we've arrived at any conclusion here, it's that I'm the idiot and that you with your ink, a dinka bottle of ink. Yeah, there's a guy I think he stinks. The cork fell out.

If he buys, if he buys a coat, I hope it's mink. No, now you're mocking, What's up bro? What's up bro?

Hey, go have some orange juice. you should see a shrink. go have some orange juice, you baby. Yeah, dipsy dipsy daddily-doo.

Yeah, I was young, but then I grew. My favorite food was beef au jus.

There's always beef au jus with you.

I'm in Britain, I've got to use the loo, that's the one I'm going to use, you know, that's what I'm using. From now on, I want to see how far it can go.

Can you remember it? Do you remember what I said? Dipsy, dipsy, bodily-boo? I was young, but then I grew. My favorite food was beef au jus.

I was in England and I used the loo. Yeah, when I'm in England, I use the loo. I forgot it immediately after you said it. But why can't that become legitimate? I want to hear kids saying that.

Okay, because dipsy, dipsy bodily-boo. Yeah, I was a child, but then I grew okay. My favorite food is beef au jus.

That's where I think, where you lose everybody. I don't think so, okay, if you think so, you know what? I was on a I had to play the stage at Bonnaroo, the main stage you were there for this.

I was when you were on tour, when I was on tour, and it was a sea. It was just that reverse shot you see at Woodstock, where all you see is people.

And then the distance, you see some towers with lights and I had to go out there and I remembered, there's no subtlety. This is a crowd that can hear plugged in rock and roll through giant stacks. You can't go out there in front of that crowd. So I remembered what they liked was when I'd come out and I'd go like, Bonnaroo, how do you do?

And they'd go.

And I did a couple of variations of that, and then I'll never forget I had this microphone where I went. Let's go get some beef au jus.

Hundreds of thousands of people suddenly got very quiet. I knew it was time to say, I just imagined them parting down the middle and leaving.

Are you ready? Are you ready?

It was a lot of that, I realized that's what they like. Yeah, just questions, you know what? When you start rhyming beef au jus, it's time to bring pink out there, you know?

Let's jump in pink. Remember Nas? Yeah, I do. I was like, it's not time to bring pink out. I think it's time for you to go into a home.

Yeah, it's time for me to go all right. God bless, Godspeed. Get some beef.

Inka dinka, bottle of ink, the cork fell out. No, no, no, no, no beef au jus.

Conan O'Brien needs a friend with Conan O'Brien. Sona Movsesian and Matt Gourley Produced by Me Matt Gourley executive produced by Adam Sachs. Nick Liao and Jeff Ross at Team Coco and Colin Anderson and Cody Fisher at Earwolf. Theme song by the White Stripes.

Incidental music by Jimmy Vivino Take it away, Jimmy.

Our supervising producer is Aaron Blair and our associate talent producer is Jennifer. Samples engineering by Eduardo Perez. Additional production support by Mars Melnick, Talent booking by Paula Davis, Gina Batista and Brit Kahn. You can rate and review this show on Apple Podcasts, and you might find your review read on a future episode.

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