Trump’s day of reckoning in New York: Politics Weekly America podcast
2023-04-05 00:17:16
Every Friday, Guardian columnist and former Washington correspondent, Jonathan Freedland, invites experts to help analyse the latest in American politics. From politicians to journalists covering the White House and beyond, Jonathan and his guests give listeners behind the scenes access to how the American political machine works.
This is The Guardian.
There were no handcuffs, no mugshot, no perp walk. But Donald Trump was arrested in New York on Tuesday. Today was an historic day in Lower Manhattan as America learned the full extent of the allegations against the former. And he was charged with 34 felony counts of falsifying business records for alleged hush money payments made during the 2016 presidential election, Trump pleaded not guilty to all 34 counts, setting up a potential trial early next year. That could see the streets of Lower Manhattan packed with supporters and spectators for weeks.
And now this massive election interference at a scale never seen before in our country.
Trump then ignored the judge's plea to avoid saying anything that could incite violence or civil unrest, instead saying things like this.
Our country is going to hell.
So what happens next for Trump, for New York and for 2024?
I'm Joni Grieve in for Jonathan Friedland, and this is Politics Weekly America.
We actually first got an inkling of just how crazy things would be when reporters started lining up for a seat in the courtroom around 3.
30 p.
M on Monday, and they were not handing out passes until 8 a..m. on Tuesday.
So, Julia Marsh is the New York editor for Politico, and she has been leading a team covering the events of this week.
I think things just continued to build from there, with an incredible security presence around the lower Manhattan Courthouse. You had a pro-trump protest organized by Georgia Republican Representative Marjorie Taylor Greene. Every American should take a stand. This is what happens in Communist country and a counter protest by some local Democratic leaders.
All of that was outnumbered by the hundreds of reporters from across the globe who were covering the demonstrations. And then, of course, the anticipation to build up to Trump, taking his motorcade from Trump Tower in Manhattan down to the Lower Manhattan Courthouse to the corner.
And the former president, Donald Trump is about to step out of this SUV and enter the Manhattan D.
A.
's office, where he will be placed under arrest.
You know, waving at the crowd. As soon as he walked through that door, where the district attorney's office is, he had indeed surrendered. And then it was a few hours before he walked, very solemn faced, into the courthouse to face the music, so to speak.
And how did New York officials prepare for this huge event? I know that both Trump Tower and the Manhattan Courthouse were.
Heavily secured, there have been security preparations ongoing for several weeks, with members of the Secret Service, the NYPD, court officials and Manhattan District Attorney D.A. Bragg's staff meeting to talk about preparations. You know, we had reported originally, the D.A. wanted Trump to surrender around 6 a...m.
On Tuesday morning, Secret Service said Not so fast, so this was all highly orchestrated.
And to walk us through step by step. When did Trump arrive? And.
How did he arrive? So Trump arrived? He left his Trump Tower penthouse around 1 p..m. on Tuesday in a motorcade and drove south down Manhattan to the courthouse. It's about a 30 minute drive.
And his motorcade pulled right up to the door of the Lower Manhattan Courthouse, which is also where the district attorney has his office. He stepped out, waved to the crowd and walked in. As soon as he enters that building, he is technically under arrest. Yes, he will be in the custody of the D.A.'s office.
Investigators, obviously with the Secret Service. And I know there might be some people out there, maybe who have been charged with crimes. Who may be wondering why Trump didn't have the same experience that they did. Why was Trump not handcuffed or have his mugshot taken once he arrived at the courthouse?
There's several reasons for that, of course. He's a former president of the United States of America, he is no regular defendant. Secret Service continues to protect him, so that is highly unusual.
He is not a flight risk, so he did not need to be handcuffed. We had expected a mugshot, as is routine in these arraignments, but it turns out District Attorney Bragg decided one was not necessary. I think also, you know, it would have given a lot of fodder to former President Trump supporters. They're all already making, you know, t-shirts and merchandise with his The Mugshot. That Never happened to. Kind of fan the political flames here saying this is a political prosecution.
I know that courts in New York are very strict in terms of media coverage, we knew that there would be no filming allowed in the courtroom. And on Monday, the judge overseeing this case, Juan Marchand, issued a ruling that only a handful of still photographers would be allowed to take pictures inside the room. And he said that no electronic equipment would be allowed at all. So, as much as you can tell Julia what happened exactly in the courtroom once Trump arrived?
My colleague, our main legal reporter in New York, Erica Ordon, did get one of those coveted seats in the courtroom. And and she was not allowed to have electronics, so right afterward, she called me to download all her notes. You know, she talked about President Trump, kind of shuffling out of the courtroom afterward, with his hands on his side. He made very little eye contact with the judge, but, you know, seemed pleased with his lawyers when they said things in support of his defense. She said The judge, you know, kind of used a real matter of fact tone, of course. Former President Trump has attacked the judge, you know, accused him of bias.
And also has attacked pretty viciously. Manhattan District Attorney Bragg, The first Black district attorney in Manhattan, called him an animal. Bragg was indeed in the courtroom with Trump and was sitting in the front behind Trump, flanked by some of his staffers.
We had an inkling that Trump was going to face a few dozen charges in this case, but what specifically did he end up being?
Charged with, he was charged with the falsification of business records. This is all related to hush money payments he made to women, including the adult film actress Stormy Daniels, to keep quiet about an alleged affair that he says didn't happen. That was being threatened to being leaked to the public and the press in the heart of the campaign in 2016. And former President Trump's then attorney Michael Cohen says that, you know, he made these payments, these hush money payments on Trump's behalf, and they were later disguised, as you know, kind of regular business payments to Michael Cohen. And that that was the crime that Bragg is alleging happened here, not not the actual payment, but how it was misclassified.
And once the indictment was unsealed, what was the general reaction? I know that there were some Republicans, even some Republicans, who have not traditionally aligned themselves with Trump. Like Senator Mitt Romney, who basically made the argument that they thought that these charges were somewhat overreaching, what do you make of that?
That's certainly true. And it's not only Mitt Romney, but there are some legal analysts on the left and others on the left WHO who agree that this really isn't the strongest case. And it's really not the one that should be the focus, it should be something like the matter in Georgia, that has to do with election interference.
Trump obviously ended up pleading not guilty to all of the charges, but what happened after he left court? It was pretty much back to the campaign trail, as usual for him, right?
Sure, yeah, he. He was expected to speak in the hallway of the courtroom, and he didn't do that. Instead, he left in his motorcade and then flew back to his home, his now primary residence in Mar-a-Lago, Florida.
Thank you very much everybody and we have to save our country. God bless you all.
And he gave a yes, a campaign style speech, hitting on all the usual topics. In addition to, you know, railing against these legal prosecutions and painting them as witch hunts.
It's an insult to our country, as the world is already laughing at us.
Almost immediately, Trump ignored a plea from the judge to refrain from using quote inflammatory rhetoric regarding the case. Instead, he returned to Florida and delivered a speech in which he lashed out against prosecutors, suggesting America is, quote going to hell. He also went after the judge, as you mentioned earlier.
I have a Trump hating judge with a Trump hating wife and family.
And even started talking about Judge Marchand's daughter, who works at a campaign firm that has worked for several prominent Democrats, including President Biden and Vice President Kamala Harris. It's certainly an interesting tone to take ahead of a major trial. What do you make of this decision, Julia?
Yeah, you know, it's funny. We were talking amongst ourselves, like, can he effectively campaign and rally his base without really angering the judge? And I think it's for him a really tightrope for him to walk. There was some talk about a potential gag order, of course, you know. Republicans said that would be completely unprecedented and a First Amendment violation during a political campaign. The judge yesterday said there is, you know, no indication that that was anything he would do, but did warn against inciting any sort of civil unrest.
And he referenced some social media postings by By Trump that had attacked District Attorney Alvin Bragg.
Staying on Bragg for a second, Trump suggested he should be prosecuted, or at least resign for leaking grand jury information. Now there's no evidence that that actually happened, but Trump supporters now know Bragg's name very well.
Beginning with the radical left, George Soros-backed prosecutor Alvin Bragg of New York.
How has Bragg reacted to all of that attention? It'll probably be a tricky few months and years for him now, won't it?
It will, but he's been, he's been very stoic, very understated, he has. He has not spoken publicly about it at all. The only thing he's responded to are some requests by House Republicans for information about his investigation.
And in letters back to those House Republicans, he's basically said, Back off, you don't have jurisdiction here. And he has internally tried to console and comfort his staff and tell them, We will pursue justice and we will keep you safe. Although there have been several death threats against D..A. Bragg and his staff.
And there was also an incident of white powder that turned out to be, you know, innocuous. But that was sent to his office a couple of weeks ago.
So now that Trump has entered his initial plea in this case, what happens next?
So the first immediate deadline is there are 45 days for prosecutors to hand over discovery in the case. And then there is also, I believe, the first motion return date in August. We'd spoken earlier that the prosecutors originally asked for a trial date in January 2024. Trump's defense team immediately said That is a way too aggressive timeline. We were thinking more spring 2024..
And actually, the judge seemed to agree that the January 2024 would be too early. But, you know, we do expect a flurry of motions from the defense trying to delay this, trying to change the venue. Perhaps asking the judge to recuse himself, claiming he's biased because he has ruled against the defense in some unrelated cases against the Trump Organization and a former Trump Org executive.
Assuming that Trump's motion to dismiss is not successful, how will New York City itself prepare for any upcoming trial?
I mean, New York City, it's funny, it really was, in many ways, business as usual in the city yesterday, people went about their lives. Except for, you know, some traffic headaches and some security around just that lower Manhattan Courthouse and Trump Tower in midtown Manhattan. You know, the NYPD is just very accustomed to dealing with major security issues. You have, the U..N.
General Assembly with leaders from across the world here. Every single September, you have, you know, major demonstrations. We saw the George Floyd protests a couple of summers ago. They're actually quite well prepared to handle, you know, any related demonstrations and to keep the immediate areas.
Secure. So it sounds like for you, as someone who lives and works in New York, you're not too worried about this circus returning to town eventually.
No, not really. It's, and again, we also have. Of course, there's nothing like this historic moment where it's a former president being charged criminally for the first time ever. But there are a lot of high profile defendants who come through the courthouses here. So again, it is somewhat routine, if not, you know, unprecedented.
And as all of this is unfolding, Trump will definitely continue to campaign and will likely try to use his day in court to his political advantage. But Julia, in talking to your colleagues, how do you think Trump reacted to this week? He might say it's a political witch hunt, but he has been charged with felony crimes. That is a huge deal. Do you get the sense that that has really sunk in for him?
It seems like it I don't, I don't like to to read the tea leaves too much. But when we saw him after, he'd surrendered and he'd been in the courthouse being processed, you know, we talked about. He was not handcuffed or he did not get his photograph taken, but he, we do believe he was fingerprinted. And he was indeed, you know, under arrest for a period of time being held by the district attorney being read the charges.
They are felony charges that carry a potential maximum of four years in jail, though probation is more likely in the case of someone without a criminal record. But when he walked through that door, he, he was really quite quite stone faced. And again, we had anticipated hearing him speak to the press in the hallway. He, he did not do that. he, he walked in quite solemnly.
Julia Marsh during a pretty dramatic week for the city of New York. I'm very grateful you could join me on Politics Weekly America. Thank you so much.
Thanks for having me.
Before I go, just an update on what happened in that election we reported on in last week's episode. Janet Protasewicz, the Liberal judge from Milwaukee, won her race for a seat on Wisconsin's Supreme Court, beating her Conservative rival Dan Kelly. The result means the balance of the state's highest court has flipped from a conservative majority for the first time in 15 years. And for something completely different. For movie lovers out there, I want to let you know about the Guardian's Documentaries newsletter. It's free, and it is a great opportunity to connect with independent filmmakers through exclusive interviews and q&as.
There will be a link to where you can sign up to the newsletter on today's episode description on the Guardian website. But for now, it's goodbye. The producer is Danielle Stevens, the executive producer is Maz Ebtehaj and I'm Joni Grieve. We'll be back on Friday. Thanks, as always, for listening.
This is The Guardian.
v1.0.0.260408-1-a910ba6_os