Most of Your Poor Financial Decisions Start With You

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, this is the Ramsey Solutions Show. It's the Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual, amazing relationships. Dr. John Deloney, number one bestselling, author a couple times over, and host of the Dr. John Deloney Show, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today.

Hi Dave, hi John. Thank you so much for taking my call.

Sure, what's up?

So, I'm in a predicament that I've actually made myself. I got married, second marriage for both of us, not quite six years ago. And at that time, I had been through a pretty bad divorce and had a pretty traumatic first marriage. So, definitely was healing from that, and met this wonderful man, so nice to me and kind to me, and I just fell head over heels in love with him. I knew he was broke, I knew he didn't have any money, and that just didn't matter to me.

I'm also the... So, he doesn't earn an income?

He did. We are both retired. now. He does not have any retirement.

How old are you, Dash?

I'm 60.. He's 64..

Okay.

He took Social Security early. He was working at that time, and then, when you start taking Social Security, you can only work so many hours. You can only make so much money, so that knocked his availability down to where he really couldn't work very much. But since then, we've both retired and relocated.

So, what do you feel like? the core question is?

I think I'm just trying to figure out if I'm being taken advantage of. Is this just something where I'm being... I've brought something up several times and I just... Nothing changes. Nothing...

Hold on. This isn't a money issue. This is a respect issue. You don't respect the man that you're married to. Because I bring home a quote-unquote income to the house, but my wife, my God Almighty, if she disappeared, the house would go away.

I'm not. No, I'm very afraid of confrontation. I get very nervous about talking about something like this.

And then you end up in resentment land because you spend a ton of time having imaginary conversations in your head, don't you?

Yes. Oh, I do.

That's cruel and unfair to him.

And doubt. Yes.

So if you're going to be mad at him...

Kind of hard on your brain, too. Yeah.

If you're going to be mad at him, he at least deserves to know what he could do. Give him a path back to relationship. Because right now he married somebody with a lot of money. And he might think he's fulfilling his duties as your husband by being the fun-loving guy that just whatever, whatever partridge in a pear tree. He needs to know.

Yeah, I do. I do love him. And I don't want anything to end.

What does he need to do to be a person that you would respect? Because he doesn't need to work. You guys are retired.

No.

It's not a work ethic thing. What is it that he's supposed to do? that makes him valid in your mind?

I think just pitching in, say, I don't know, $1,000 a month, something.

Pitch in from what? I'm not the only one. Where's he got money?

He has social security money and he gets other money from...

So you guys don't have your finances combined at all?

We do have a joint checking account, but he's never put any money in it. So no.

But does he have an avenue to do that?

He could, yeah. He could put money in there, yeah. Because he's on the account.

But if he's looking at your vast amount of money in that account, and he looks at his piddly government check...

Yeah.

See what I'm saying? He needs to know. And again, I think he's going to put $1,000 in that account, and that's not what the issue is going to be.

Yeah.

If he started depositing $1,000 a month in that account, you'd be right back here in six months.

I don't know if I would be. I don't... It's really... To me, it's like you just said, it's not about money. It's more about respect.

Well, since y'all are married, y'all get to rewrite them together.

Right.

And so I think it's a matter of sitting down and having a conversation and say, we've been married for a few years.

I need you to do this to have me have positive, respectful feelings towards you.

And what can I do for you so that you can have positive, respectful feelings towards me? Let's put all of it on the table. Let's give each other a chance for success.

Yeah. 100% of what you don't say, he can't hear. Right.

Yeah.

I've been married 43 years. I'm still working on that.

Dave, I am too, man. I am too.

The things that our insurance head that I have never heard are amazing.

But you're in trouble for them. I'm always in trouble. You better fix them. What's wrong?

This is the Ramsey Show.

Hi, Merry Christmas.

Good. How can we help?

Hi, so just to cut right to the chase, I just took out my first student loan ever. Super nerve-wracking. It's for my master's in social work and it's about $45,000.. That's without the interest. So I'm just trying to figure out what's a great path to start on that, like how to tackle it super fast, because I don't want to be with this debt for like 10 years.

You just took out your first loan for a semester or you just finished a degree program and you have $45,000 in the hole?

No, so it's like $6,000 a semester, but they just gave it all to me at once. So it's $45,000 is what they gave me at once.

Who's they? I've never heard of that ever.

It's financial aid, FAFSA.

So they just cut you a check and deposit it for $45,000?.

Well, not into my bank. It goes directly to my school and then they start paying it that way. So it's already given to my school and my school just takes it out.

Okay, so you're starting your master's and you just financed the whole thing.

Well, Dave, I bet what's happened is I bet you've been approved for the entire program. I bet your university doesn't have a check for $45,000 because they wouldn't prepay like that, because you could quit, you can drop out. It could be a whole thing. But my guess is you were approved for the program and the school gave you a letter that said you've qualified for $45,000 in federal aid and every semester you're going to have to re-up and re-up, and re-up and re-up. Okay.

So you're just starting your master's?

Yes.

You're spending $45,000 to get a master's in social work. to make what kind of money?

Not enough. It's about 90 grand, which would be the salary for it.

There's no way you'll make 90 grand?

That is the salary in Florida for it.

Where?

Right now. I work at a hospital.

And a starting social worker with the LMSW makes $90,000?.

Not starting out, no. But I've been doing social work and case management and all that stuff for years. So with the experience and once I get it, I'm already making $15,000 right now. So they're bumping it up. Wow.

That's extraordinary. Good for them, because that's a field that needs more people. that, drastically, is usually underpaid. I would, as a guy who's, I've taught graduate school and mental health programs, I've lived this world. What I would plead to you is to, you make $50,000 a year, I would cut back for the next three years and cashflow this program.

Yeah, that was one of my big fears.

The way it doesn't linger is you don't take it.

Don't take it. Don't take the check.

Pay cash for your degree is what John's saying.

$6,000 a semester, go, pay it outright for the three semesters, plus your 3,000 hours, whatever you have to do.

So you still not got any financial matching for education?

No, because I'm not a nurse. I only have it for nurses.

Okay.

And what enticed me to it was because they said at first that they would, and then, when I got here, they said, oh, sorry, no, it's just for nurses.

Yeah, I'd find another place to work too, while you're at it. I'm serious, 100% serious. If they're going to lure you in and then they're going to bait and switch you, that's a company without integrity. I wouldn't work for them.

Gotcha.

And I know this is a radical shift, but I would go to the school and say, hey, I need my semester by semester cost. And they're probably going to tell you, well, it depends if you take six or nine hours, whatever, and say, what is a full-time and was a part-time student going to cost? And then you make $50,000 a year until you find another job where you'll make 60.. I want you to cashflow this.

So what we're trying to tell you is that uneasy feeling inside of you when you're called is real. It's right. And it's telling you, don't do this. And we're telling you it's right. Don't do it.

Hey, Dave, how's it going?

Better than I deserve. What's up?

I have a question about getting an SBA loan to purchase a business. What's your thoughts on that?

Is never, never, never, under any circumstances. Okay. It's a disaster. Why would you buy a, why would you buy a business, a small business?

Um, well, I travel 10 months out of the year and my wife stays at home with kids, and it's a taxing life and we're trying to find a happy medium for everybody. And we stumbled, what we think is a good opportunity per se.

And we just, uh, what is the, what? is the industry, that the business you're looking?

at is making signs.

Okay. And how much is the purchase?

Uh, approximately $1.2 million. Yes, sir.

For a sign franchise.

It's not a franchise. It's a person that started the business and he's looking to retire.

Okay. All right. Um, let me give you a different way to skin. This cat may be okay, but, um, let me, uh, 80% of small businesses fail in the first five years.

Okay.

The number one cause of small business failure when we survey them, and we work with 10,000 small businesses and entre leadership right now is what's called cashflow problems. Cashflow problems is a, uh, a phrase that means a lot of things, but it primarily means two things. I can't pay my debt payments and I didn't pay my taxes on time, and I get screwed by the federal government. And, um, so you're going to have a million, two floating around, around your neck, trying to drag you down while you're trying to run a business. This guy's already been running for a few years.

Um, he pays himself a salary, but now, what's the net profit on the business? On average over the last, uh, four years is around 250..

Okay. A million, two is a little rich.

Yeah. We know that part of it. We're just, we're in the beginning process and we're trying to figure it out.

Here's how I have, here's how I've taught some people who hand the business to the next generation and want to be bought out, or they haven't, to the employee, or an employee or a buyer like you that want to be bought out. I don't want you to get payments on a million, two and Fauci decide we're having another quarantine.

Okay.

That'll put you into bankruptcy court, sir. It did a bunch of people and cause nobody making signs or making plexiglass, but they weren't making signs. So you were screwed if that was, if you'd done this two years ago. So learn a lesson from that. Now, what you can do is agree to pay him 80 or 90% of the profits after you take a basic small salary out until he gets his million, and about a million is about what it's worth.

Fake it till you make it. It's popular career advice, but it doesn't work for very long. If you don't love what you do, you can't fake the enthusiasm and energy you need to win at work. You also can't fake your physical health and energy. Everybody knows we should eat more fruits and veggies, but fruit chews and veggie chips don't count.

Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey personality, is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225.. Well, it's Christmas time. Merry Christmas.

Hey, Dave. Thanks so much for taking my call.

Sure. What's up?

Hey, so I'm just calling today. I've been listening for about two to three months now. I'm 20 years old. I've been doing an every dollar budget for about a month now, and I am needing to get my own place in ASAP, and I don't even know the first place to start preparing for it. My income is fairly low, and my monthly bills are pretty high.

What do you do?

I process medical records right now.

Okay. And you're 20 years old.

Yes, sir, 20, and I only have a high school diploma.

Okay. Are you looking for new work? Because your income sucks.

Yeah, yeah, it does.

No degree's, not a holdback at all.

Yeah, I live in rural Tennessee. I saw a sign the other day that said McDonald's said $20 an hour.

Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Yeah, I do. I do have a side hustle that I am starting after the holidays are over. I'm starting a side hustle, and that'll be like $15 an hour, but that's only the weekend that I can do a side hustle, because my job now is a nine-to-five.

So what? What happens after five?

After five—.

After five is when you work.

I have—.

From 5 a.m. to 9 a.m.

When you're broke, that's when you work.

Yeah, I do have a—. Well, I kind of have a one-year-old. My boyfriend has a one-year-old.

You can't kind of have a one-year-old. That's impossible.

I don't think I have the money to, no. Right now, I'm living with my sister. I've been out on my own since I was, like, 17, 18.. I've been living in people's rooms and just renting rooms, and now I kind of want a place for just me and my boyfriend and his son.

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. You're not in a position to be taking care of people.

No, no, no.

If he wants to get married and take care of you, we'll talk about it. What does he make?

He's not working right now.

Oh, this is real good.

Maggie.

Maggie, do you hear yourself out loud?

He's a firefighter. Yes, sir.

If you were talking to your daughter and your daughter was you, you'd smack her.

Well, I wish my mama would have.

Yeah, I know, but I mean, you listen to yourself. I'm going to move in with a guy who has a one-year-old and doesn't work.

And I have to take care of the kids.

And I'm supposed to take care of these people. I think you need to go somewhere where there's grown-ups.

Why he's not working right now is he's becoming a firefighter. So that doesn't start until the beginning of January, though. So right now he's just waiting to see.

So right now he's not in school to be a firefighter. He's only waiting for which firehouse he's going to be doing. So why is he sitting on his butt during Christmas?

Yeah, yeah, it's a good question.

He should be driving for Uber from 5 to 8, 5 a.m. to 8 a.m.

You want to date my daughter, you work.

And then work all day and then delivering pizzas at night. Because that's what men do when they don't have a job and they have a one-year-old.

Yeah, yeah. And he hasn't worked for about eight months now.

I can almost guarantee you he's not going to the fire academy. You know how. I know firemen don't live like that. That's not the character of a fireman. I know those men and those women.

No, he's already gone, hadn't he?

Well, he's waiting to hear back.

Oh, he hasn't started yet.

No, Dave, he hasn't even started the fire academy yet.

He hasn't worked for eight months.

Oh, I thought he just finished. He was waiting to get assigned a job. Hold on.

He has a one-year-old. Has he not worked for eight months? Have you supported him?

Yeah. Oh, my God. His mom, his mom, does a lot. And then Maggie, Maggie, Maggie, please listen to two old farts, okay?

Both of us have daughters.

Run, run as fast as you can. Run.

Oh, no. Yes. Oh, yes. I don't think I can do that. Okay.

I'm sorry. I can't help you, darling. You're running blind into the wall. You're going to blow the car up when you hit it. Oh, I'm sorry.

You're being preyed upon, sweetheart.

I'm telling you, this is not going to happen, all right? And so you need an ugly, angry, older brother or father, like one of us, and we would tell him to go away, and if he didn't, we'd help you go away, because you got the stuff to go. get it done in the marketplace, girl. You can go out there, get you three jobs, get you an apartment, start you a life, start taking a degree field. I'll send you a copy of Ken Coleman's book, From Paycheck to Purpose.

And when you have a man with a one-year-old who's responsible, he doesn't work for eight months, we call that a deadbeat, a burnout.

Please, Maggie.

He should be ashamed of himself, man.

But you're not gonna do it, and you're gonna learn the hard way, and you're gonna call me up at 25, and you're gonna go, yeah, you were right. And now I've got all this debt because I went and bought him a car, and we rented an apartment, and he didn't pay the bill, and the landlord threw us out, and I've got a little judgment lien from the landlord, and you're gonna be that caller if you go through with this. Please do not go, move in with this guy. If you don't dump him, that's your business. I think you're on the way to dumping him.

So, and let's say this. So, for those of you who have grown up the last five or six years, like Maggie, you're on your own. You're bouncing from room to room to room, and you spend a lot of time on social media. It appears that things just happen. It appears that bills just get paid.

And then you develop a plan that is a career where you don't have to work 80 hours a week.

There you go.

But it takes a few years to get into that. But most of us that are older than 30 have worked more than 40 hours, like more than 80 hours, the first five years of our working life.

Or 10 of our life.

Or more, yeah. And so, and that's not a, you have no life balance. No, I have a life that you wish you freaking had. I can tell you that. You just wish you had a 10th of my life.

That was a good self-censor, Dave. I got that. You got it.

Just right there.

This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. This is Deloney, and I'm always railing against social media, especially in the summer, because everyone uploads the highlight reels of their perfect bodies, and perfect vacations, and perfect kids. And I know they're not real. And I also know that I'm blessed beyond my wildest dreams, but I still find myself wishing my life was like other people's. And, based on the data, I know this is happening to you too.

Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225.. This show has become inordinately successful, with 30 million of you or so out there in a given month on YouTube's podcast, on the various platforms, the 680 radio stations that carry us, because we understand that personal finance is not math. The problem with my money is the guy I shave with.

Yeah, and I'm just haunted. But I, like that last call, haunts me, because when you say it, you won't accept this for your own child. Everyone goes, no, I would never accept that. But you just become blind to it, and you just keep doing it, and you just keep doing it, and you keep doing it. And you wonder, you keep going back to the money issue.

It can be a relational thing. I mean, it's, you know, one of the jokes that we had in the early days of the show was, you know, if you marry a woman that likes spending, you better, enjoy working.

Right.

You know? And so, but it's also the opposite way, obviously. If you marry a man that likes spending, you better enjoy working. And so, because you can't, but you cannot earn it. You can't keep up.

The only drama in my house, I bring it.

Occasionally. there was drama before I got there. Right. But it's not like, wait till your daddy gets home. No, fear the wrath of Sharon.

Yeah, it's fun. They say that the, one of the greatest.

But our friend, Dr. Henry Cloud, with the book Boundaries, whether it is your marriage partner or not, just the other people in your life,

your business partner, your buddies,

suck the marrow out of your bones because you won't put up a boundary. Or, for some reason, don't know to put up a boundary. You weren't raised in such a way. Well, I was raised, you always take care of daddy. Well, did you notice that your daddy is a problem?

Or, well, that's just so-and-so, like, stop.

That's just the way he is.

I would love, a great exercise for folks is to write down the top five to 10 to 15 people in your life. They can be coworkers, they can be family members, they can be friends.

I mean, when you come out of a meeting or you come out of a social gathering with someone and you feel like you need to take a shower, I don't want to repeat this. Right. I'm done. Right. And my wife's like, well, we need to be nice.

We need to be nice to us.

I'm not going to be nice. I can be nice from a further distance. I'll wave from over there, you know. But this close physical proximity with slime is a problem. Yeah.

I like you, but I'm not gonna hang out.

Yeah, it's, I can be nice to you. I can help you.

I love you. I'm not gonna.

I can encourage you, but I'm not going, you're not going to be part of my crew.

That's right.

Yeah. Because you become who you hang around with.

And if you find out that you're married to somebody who is more of a vampire than a contributor, this is the year. Let this be the year that you put that on the table and say, let's build something new. Let's, let's build something new.

I'm taking your sharp teeth.

Yeah. Well, we're like the first caller of this hour. That I'm going to be clear for the first time, because I find myself, I don't like you. I don't want to be around you. The things you do annoy me.

We're going to build something new. And the reason for the sidebar right now is this. This is the time of year to look at this and say, okay, I want you to leave from this little, little rant that we've done for the last five minutes. I want you to leave with this idea. Who you hang around with and who you are going to create relationship with is a hundred X more important towards whether you're able to build wealth than whether you understand how a mutual fund works or what your income is.

Hey, John. Thanks for having me. Sure. I'll make this as quick as I can. 31 years old, married.

I think that's a qualified plan, meaning it's a type of retirement plan. Am I right?

Yes.

So if you cash it out early, you're going to get a 10% penalty plus your tax rate. So what do you make a year? What's your household income?

So I make $100,000.. My wife works part-time. She makes about $20,000..

Okay. All right. And so you're in 35% tax bracket. So you're going to pay 35% plus 10% on the money. So it's kind of mathematically like asking, hey, Dave, I want to borrow money at 45% interest to pay off some of my debt.

Okay. Hey, Travis, can I challenge you a bit? I'm sorry? Can I challenge you a little bit?

Sure.

You've been in class five weeks?

Yeah, tonight is week number five, yes.

Excellent. So you make $120,000..

Well, no. We started budgeting with every dollar.

John's point is this. If you look at the big number, $120,000 minus, $44,000 would be like $76,000.. If you lived on $76,000 for one year, you'd be debt-free. Not counting taxes.

I challenge you to get radical. Find what you can sell in your house. Do you have tractors?

I want you to lean down. That's what I'm saying. I think you're going to lean down into that budget. If you did it in two years, that's $2,000 a month. But $1,000 a month is not enough out of your budget.

Hey, Dave. Hey, John. Nice to talk to you guys.

You too. What's up?

Yes. So I got a question. This is about 529 plans. I have two kids, one, six, one, four. And then we just found out we have two coming next year.

I hate it. I know.

It's hard.

Way to go. Would you run for Congress?

If I had any interest, I would.

He's like, man, brother, I was thinking, Dave, but I'm also thinking about setting myself on fire.

My question is, on the Georgia 529 plan, it's tax-deductible up to $8,000 per kid per year. And we can only have two right now, because I often think you need a Social Security number for each account you set up.

No, I mean, you can do that. The downside is 529, of course, has to be used for education. And any growth on the money is going to be taxed if you pull it out for something other than, and penalized if you pull it out for something other than education. So that's your downside. So, along with making a commitment to put $50,000, which pretty well finishes it up, if you're doing this for young children, that'll be it.

Well, and I know they can... I'm not sure if this is a new rule, but you can do $10,000 a year for a private school, K-12, I believe that's what it is. That's true. Like high school, private school.

That's true. You could drain it down doing that. But if you don't put them in private school and they don't go to college, you got some money trapped in there. That's my only point. And that's okay.

Hi. So I'm calling because I have a question. So I'm 25 years old. I'm a single mother. My income is about $47,000 a year.

Good.

It's the greatest thing that ever happened to you, honey.

Last thing you need is a car payment, kiddo. You're broke.

Yeah.

But you do need a car.

Yes. Wait, when you say it's going out on you, my truck has 197,000 miles on it. Is it just ugly or is it falling apart?

No, it's not ugly. It's just starting to fall apart on me. Like, I just put $1,500 into it trying to fix it. And it's still giving me problems.

All right. So the car is probably worth, what, $2,000?.

No, not even. With the problems that it has, not even.

And you said you make what?

About $47,000..

How many kids you got?

Just one.

How old?

He's three. He's four.

Okay. Who watches him when you work?

He is at daycare.

Okay.

So, yeah.

Because the reason I'm asking is I'm trying to find you some money because I want you to scrape together, like you found the $1,500 to fix the car. I want you to scrape together $1,500 to $2,000, sell your car for $2,000 and buy a $4,000 car, which is a whole lot better than you've got now, but no car payments. Okay. And then I want you to do that again about a year from now. Okay.

Yeah. No, I'm just getting to the point where, like I'm a little frustrated. Yeah.

You know, you're a lot frustrated. I would be. I'm frustrated with you. I understand and I agree with your frustration. I don't want it to lead you to a bad decision, and it's about to.

Yeah.

Yeah. Don't do that to yourself. Let's go pay cash for the difference in a $4,000 car and a $2,000 car is very dramatic.

Yeah.

Okay. Now, are you in a good church?

I do. I do attend a church.

Do you have some guys around anywhere that could be your ugly uncle for a day or two and help you pick out a reliable car and not let someone mess with you because they think they can, but instead the ugly uncle's standing there and saying, you know, this car is not real pretty, but it's a really good, reliable mechanical car. That's the one you buy when you're buying a $4,000 car. We're not trying to buy sex appeal. We want reliability.

Of course.

Yeah. And sometimes, when you're negotiating with someone on that, people are sexist.

Yeah.

Or put a note in your church bulletin or let your folks know I'm looking for a great $3,500 car.

I'm a single mom with a three-year-old and I need a reliable $4,000 car. Would someone help me find one?

Okay.

You'll have people that raise their hand.

Yeah, you might have somebody give you one.

Hey, and, by the way, you don't like asking for help, do you?

I'm not. I am actually a police officer, so that's really hard for me to be that kind of person to reach out and ask for help.

All right, hold on. This is important. You have cast, quote, unquote, those kind of people as people who ask for help. I want you to reframe that. I want you to know that the wisest people I know ask other wise people for support and help about things they don't know.

I don't go in and negotiate on something myself, and I'm a really good business guy and a real good negotiator, but I don't go into an item or a situation that I know nothing about. I don't have any expertise in. I bring along the old, ugly uncle myself.

Okay.

And that's a really ugly uncle for Dave to bring.

If Dave says he's an ugly uncle.

Oh, my God.

Yeah. Well, I mean, you bring in the heavy, you bring in somebody beside you. And so if I'm negotiating on a tech thing, I don't know nothing about tech. I got 400 people at work here that do that, though. And so I'm going to bring in my top guy who's going to razzle, dazzle him with his academic and says all the tech words.

Well, and similarly, I guess the appearance is, we have all the answers to every one of life's questions. A bunch of acres behind my place went up for sale. And I immediately thought, oh, yeah, I know a guy. His name's Dave. And I work with him.

You can do it better. I can do it better with you than I can do it by myself. That's right. And that's all we're saying. And yeah.

Policewoman.

And police person, whatever we call it. I don't know. I cannot figure out how. But anyway, but anyway, I was trying to be nice. And then John screwed it up.

I can see you honking.

I've been driving a Jaguar and I went bankrupt. And now I'm driving Bondo buggy with a parachute on top. And, but I drove it to a thousand dollars. And then, three months later, I bought a $3,000 car. Five months later, I bought a $10,000 car.

It's significant.

It's very dramatic.

I get it.

And none of that was with car payments.

I get it. I did it. Picture you driving down the street, honking the horn. Look, Sharon, I got a thousand dollar car.

When you pull up to the stoplight and your top is settling and people are looking at you, you just turn up the rap music, right? I mean, come on, man. This is the Ramsey Show.

Right. Today's question comes from Sandra in Florida. Sandra writes, my spouse's spending is crippling our finances and our marriage. Each month we have only about five to 600 left after monthly bills and minimum debt payments. And we only have a thousand dollars saved.

right before divorce?

Yeah. Yeah. And I think we're here. I think we're close. This is way bigger, Dave than, uh, I'm glad she, I'm glad she had the courage to write is crippling our finances and our marriage, because this type of behavior tells me there's other issues of that marriage.

Yeah. This guy is, um, kind of got the axis of the world stopped through the top of his head. Everything spins around him.

He's the most important thing that ever lived.

And I'm telling you, his mama told him that. Yep. And, um, and now, um, nobody tells him anything. Yeah.

Um, I just can't imagine. Dave. I, again, I don't have a psychology for this. I can't imagine Sheila taking me out and saying, um, anything I'm doing, you're scaring me to death and me going, yeah, I don't care. I just, I don't have that in my, I don't have that in my body.

So, um, yeah, it could be just an immaturity. It could be a lot of things, um, in all seriousness, all once I get past all my frustration and my name calling, but, um, the, um, so there's two issues with this email. Number one, uh, you guys need to sit down with a marriage counselor. And if he won't go, go by yourself so that you can start to get language to how you're going to decide how much longer you're going to do this. Uh, because my experience with this, and I'm not a counselor and I'm not trained like John is, but for 30 years, I've done this and sat with couples.

When somebody says the word futile, everything I've tried.

Yeah.

It's for not, it's for nothing.

Yeah. That's lost hope.

That's lost hope. That's right.

And, uh, so you're, you're getting really close and I'm telling you, if there's a chance that you save this marriage, it's going to be with some help, guiding you through how to communicate to him. If you can get through to jello brain here and get him to do this. Okay. Now, if you can, and you turn it around, that's great. That's thing one.

And he's, I think it's important to call out this husband is not being a person of fidelity. He is not upholding the marriage vows. that said, till sickness, to sickness and health, till death. do us part. This is ours.

Sad, very sad. Josh is in Illinois. Hi, Josh. What's up?

Hi, Dave. I really appreciate you giving me your time. I'm going to try to make this quick. Sure. So in 2021, uh, so, my family and I have always used a tax assistant to file our taxes.

Now, my question is, so the guy that did your taxes calculated your taxes wrong.

Uh, that may very well be the case.

And is that what you're telling me? I'm asking you, I'm making sure I understand what you're saying.

Yes. Yes. The taxes were filed incorrectly.

Okay. And so you have a 10,000 hour tax bill that you didn't think you had.

Right. And, uh, this was from 2021, and ever since 2021, even though they just found it, they've been charging interest, and that's what they do, like that. Yeah.

But, but, but the bottom line is, is, if they had been filed correctly, you would have owed $10,000..

Uh, correct. We, we received, um, we received a refund that we probably should not have received yet.

Right. And did you go and have you had another tax professional? look at the return and make sure that the IRS's, uh, proclamation is accurate?

Yes, sir. And, and here's the thing, actually, we, we know it, we know that this is accurate because, um, it was a lady that did our returns that year. We are actually doing business right now with her sister. And not only did this original lady ghost our family over all this, she's not even talking to her sister anymore. And her and her sister had a fallen out over that.

That's doesn't mean anything.

It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter.

I'm asking the question. Have you had a tax professional that knows what the flip they're doing this time? actually go over this return and verify that you do owe $9,500 plus penalties?

Yes.

And so the sister is reliable.

Right. Yeah.

You think? why is she an enrolled agent, a CPA? What is she?

She's an enrolled agent.

All right. So you had a tax bill all along. You just didn't know it. And it's cost you 500 bucks in addition to that. Are you just going to pay it, man?

Are they liable for the penalty?

Maybe you might get 500 bucks out of them, but it's not worth the debt. gum trouble. Everybody in this story makes no sense. Yeah. You know, yeah, I would just pay it.

You'll pay more than $500 in fees.

You're going to have to pay more than $500 to have a meeting. This is the Ramsey Show.

I know you work hard for your money, and the key to keeping more of it in your pocket is by making a plan for your spending with a budget. And EveryDollar is the budgeting app that I use personally, because it's perfect for looking every dollar you make in its little president face and telling it exactly where you want it to go. Just like you told that guy in traffic exactly where you wanted him to go. And even better, EveryDollar walks you through the entire budgeting journey, so you always know your next right step. Download EveryDollar for free in the App Store or Google Play today.

Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225.. Renee and Edward are with us in Albuquerque, New Mexico. Hey, guys, how are you?

Okay, we're good. How are you?

Good. How can we help?

Well, so last year, my wife rented an apartment, and she's really sick. She has mold poisoning. She went, and the property manager guaranteed her an apartment that was mold free. She moved in. Three weeks later, had to move out, go to the emergency room.

So I'm confused. why your wife moved out and rented an apartment. I'm confused.

Because we were separated.

Oh, okay. That makes sense. And now you're back together.

Yeah, because of this.

Because of the mold?

Because I had nowhere to go.

Oh, okay.

So my question, Dave, is should... They're threatening that if she doesn't pay this, it'll ruin her credit, which is obvious. But should she pay them? Should we fight it? Should she not worry about her credit?

Okay.

Well, I mean, we're debt-free. I work. He makes good money. He makes plenty of money. Yeah, I mean, she lives with me.

Yeah. Okay. Well, obviously, the lesson learned is you didn't get it in writing. You got a verbal from the landlord, right?

Right, right.

So that's the lesson learned. This would have been a lot easier. The landlord is an individual or a manager of a complex?

He's the property manager of the complex, but not the property management company, which is the one trying to collect the fees for the property.

But this guy's an employee of them.