Chris Martin

My name is Chris Martin and I feel really great about being Conan O'Brien's friend.

I've been doing this for a number of years and I'm a real pro. Oh boy, I'm really. I'm the gold standard, which everybody has judged now sitting here with Sona.

Sona, Wouldn't you call me the gold standard? No, I wouldn't call you the gold standard. I think there's people who've done it longer than you and much better. Yeah, much better.

I think you're good, I think you're fine. Okay, I think you're okay. I have a story about the phrase the gold standard.

That involves the great Johnny Carson. Oh yeah. I had the privilege of getting to meet him a couple of times and talk to him on the phone a few times. And I remember once I sent him, I was hosting some special in the history of NBC on Late Night, I think 50 years. And so I got the chance to with my staff, we cut together these montages of every late night.

Hosts cut together all of their best stuff. So Letterman, Jack Parr, everybody, Steve Allen. I got to reach out and contact them and send them their stuff, Letterman from his Late night show, and, of course, Johnny Carson. And then I got a call.

I didn't expect, I just thought it would be. This is before email, I think. But I thought I'd just get a message that Johnny Carson either approved or didn't. And then I get this call and they say, Johnny Carson's on the line for you. And, of course, my soul left my, I mean, it was just, you know, he's the biggest star in the world all the time. I was growing up and informed everybody's idea of what a late night show was.

So I saw the blinking light and I was like, that blinking light is Johnny Carson, and someone said, No, that's the light that tells you he's on the phone, that's not Johnny. But anyway, I picked up the phone and I hit the button and there's his famous voice. And he more or less was telling me that he watched the montage and he thought it was good.

He thought we did a good job and he really liked it. And in the special, I referred to him as the gold standard, and I said, Of course, Johnny Carson, the gold standard, and he said, my only. I don't really do a Carson impression, but he said something. He said, Well, the only thing I'll take exception to is you referred to me as the gold standard.

Kind of a self-deprecating thing. That's the only thing I disagree with. You called me the it's not like a little much. You called me the gold standard, and I said, Well, keep in mind, Johnny, that gold has been greatly devalued.

And I got a little chuckle. I'm not going to say I got a huge laugh, but I got a little chuckle and I was so happy. That's so cool, yeah.

What else do you guys talk about? He then started going on and on about what a huge fan he was of mine. No, he didn't. We actually had a really nice conversation, it wasn't that long.

I don't like to over-represent things, but it was really special. I got to tell him that one of my favorite old Carson clips was he used to do this character. Art Fearn Oh yeah, and Art Fearn had this famous thing where he was like a fast-talking pitchman kind of. And he was telling you how to go someplace in L.A. to buy a certain product.

And at one point, he just,—and I was telling Johnny Carson this, I said, Oh my God. Every time my writers see this segment of Art Fearn that we show with this line in it, we die laughing. And so I said, it's the one where you're art Fearn, and you're saying, do this. Get on the 101, then switch to the 134, then get on the 5 freeway. And then he says, then take the sloss and cut off, and he says, then get out of your car and cut off your sloss.

And my writers, Oh, you met May Lee? And he says,—and it's the way he kind of rides up on his toes a little bit. And he goes. —he says, take the sloss and cut off, get out of your car, cut off your sloss. And he's got this big pointer he keeps hitting the board with.

And my writers and I, we like to think that we're edgy, young, hot shots. We just—watch that clip, and every time he does that joke, we burst out laughing. It's timeless. When you brought up Art, Fearn, I almost said, Cut off your sloss.

Cut off your sloss. I'm glad I didn't, and I said, we see that, and I said, that joke is funny every time. And he said,—it was kind of just a nice moment, because he said, Yeah, he said, it is.

And he kind of chuckled and he went, I don't know why.

And then, you know, the conversation was over pretty quickly. But it was just really nice to be able to tell him. You know how much he meant to all these young writers. Still, you know, this is years and years after he retired, so that was nice.

That's really nice. I have that memory until I lose it, sloss in his penis. Yes, oh, okay.

In this case, yes, it's a streak, though, I wish. —you know what? Oh yes.

I know the streak. Okay, I think Johnny would have loved it had you been on set. He would have loved it because he loved people like you. Sona, I'm not even kidding.

No, he did. No, No, no, I'm serious. If you had been on set, he would have loved if he'd said, get out of your car. Cut off your sloss, and if you had said, Wait a minute, is sloss in penis?

Now, of course, that would have shut down the network in 1974.

Oh, but still, I wonder, when you were allowed to say penis, he would have thought that was really funny.

Yeah, oh, it was when Saturday Night Live did that sketch of the nudist sketch, wasn't it? That was the first time you were allowed to, and I worked on that sketch. Well, there was no, you didn't. Why don't you talk about it?

Yeah, you're a penis pioneer, yeah, in that sense. Robert Smigel, he was the lead person on that sketch, but I worked on that sketch with him and wrote a song.

At the end, the penis song standards came in. I think it was actually the great Rick Ludwin. And they just said, there's no way you can do this. And we were arguing that, like, it's part of the anatomy, you should be able to say penis.

Of course, now it seems like the most tame thing in the world. But you get weird when people say, vagina, Oh, don't do that, so you would be like, Oh, okay, don't do that.

So censor vagina? Yeah, oh God, please.

I know you more as dickhead, quite a reputation.

Of course, my nom de plume is Dickhead, but also in some parts of Europe, I'm known as the penis man. Everyone calls me something different. Okay, well, I'm very excited about our guest today. He is the co-founder and lead vocalist of the seven-time Grammy award-winning band Coldplay.

The band is currently on its sold-out Music of the Spheres World Tour. This one's a little different. He did not come to our studio. It was kind of a fun field trip, I went out to Malibu.

Well, fun for me, because let me point out that Sona and Matt did not come. I wanted to lessen our carbon footprint, especially with real big stars, so I just wanted to make sure that everything was just right. We had a proper conversation, you know, because you know the way you always cut in a lot and say things like, I'm hungry.

I am hungry, I am always hungry, and he probably would have fed me. Get me some stew, Chris Martin Stew.

I want a deal. Stew Well, yeah, he's from England. They always have a veal, Stew handy.

Anyway, I met him, he has this very cool sort of compound out in the Malibu area and got to meet him there. So it wasn't a proper, wouldn't you say? This is true, Eduardo? Not a proper. Soundproof studio. You will hear some ambient noises.

Yes, you might hear a weed whacker here or there, and I'm the one operating it. I don't know. No one told me that that was going to hurt the podcast, that's odd.

Eduardo, you were there, you had fun.

Here we go. But Adam, you were there too.

Well, it'll be a fun 20 seconds anyway. Very excited he's on the pod.

Chris Martin, welcome.

I feel great about being here with you. I don't know what we just did. We tried to high five, but I think I put my hand out in the incorrect way.

And then at 2 a.

M.

We're going to talk to you for one minute, yeah, and then we're going to cut to, Yeah. I was like, Okay, cool.

And they have people doing tricks with monkeys. And then it's time for the Beatles and you're thinking, why would you even have any kind of show other than you've got the Beatles, you just have them on?

I think it's the same for talk shows. There's great guests and there's probably ones that you have to scrape the barrel a bit.

That's the way I've always looked at it.

Yeah, they love to be funny and they tell stories. And I mean, I was always blown away by that and I would always tell them. There's something in the water, there's something about in the UK, where no, no, you need to be able to tell a story, you need to be able to land a joke. It's in the blood, I think.

Whereas American actors can take themselves really seriously. And there's no one around to say, shut your face, you're acting like an idiot. And I think that's to me. That's where the difference is.

Look, rather than I don't, really want to, I don't. I'm trying to remove any conflict in terms of. We've tried for years to sort of see if the sort of way of changing people's minds is telling them they're wrong. And I don't think it is. I definitely feel that more strongly than ever, so I'm trying to just listen.

I mean, you're a lighter example. I'm talking about if someone's talking about fascism or this or that.

Yeah, but I do think that when I was 12 or 13 and Song started arriving, there was something in me that felt like, Oh, these are really special. But then, on the other hand, there was nothing nearby to measure it against. Or no one in our—even in the region, had ever gone out and done that. So it did seem impossible, but I still headed towards it, if that makes sense, I feel that no matter where you grow up or in what social strata. If you just have a couple of people say a couple of the right things to you, it boosts you enough to get to the next island.

I don't know why he's there, but he's there.

And often, if you analyze our songs after the fact, they're so simple that we would never have allowed ourselves to do that had we known. Oh, it's just E to A to B to e.

That's there's always something in your songs, and it's a compliment that is somewhat different. Do you know what I mean? Even if you think, well, this is just a straight B, No, it's not, it's really not.

But maybe I can make things weirdly. Me, yes. And that's what I feel so encouraged about around the whole world right now is seeing people become themselves, even if it's a bit different. Yes, because that's how I feel about our music.

And I don't claim it's the best, but it's definitely the most us.

I think you won't mind me saying.

But his role in the band, I realize, has always been sort of to say, we've got too much of this flavor, change this. He sort of has this connoisseur overview.

Uh-huh. We both rely on the feedback of other people for our livelihood.

You have all these different buildings. And then I thought I could be a cult leader here, you know, yes.

Okay, and then Phil, who is our kind of creative director.

And we were both in a blues band with this slightly older kid who was teaching us about Motown. We were like, that's what we're going to do, but with no real knowledge of how. So, for whatever reason, we've all got our gifts in the world and mine is. I get sent songs and I get a very clear idea of how we're supposed to, where we're supposed to go as a band.

And I get sent ideas all the time for this and this, and this and this and this and this and so. And Phil does, too, in a different way for more, sort of where we should play, or let's release an album then, or something like that. So the two of us are the ones who come in with. We've got to do this, this, this and this. So to counterbalance that you have will and guy who. We're not talking about music, we're just talking about how the band operates.

They are more of the naysayers in a good way to make sure we don't do all the stupid ideas, but they sort of pick what actually is good. And that's the same with music. Except that on all of our songs, I know this is a long-winded answer. I'm sorry, on all of our songs. They are like a production line mostly, which is that I get sent, sort of the skeleton of the song and the title and everything. And I'll present that and then Johnny, Guy and Will Will layer their stuff on it.

And it's not finished until they've all either put their parts on it or decided not to. So we always split our publishing royalties, whatever the song is, because it allows people to choose what's best for the song. Because they're going to get paid either way. So they might say this doesn't need any drums on it, but I'll still get paid for drumming, so I don't need to put drums on it. Does that make sense?

That takes all of these skills. That a lot of people who could get to the point that you were at musically would say, Oh, I can't do that. But you are very adept at it, and I think that's a whole other skill set.

Get that in.

This is another place where I feel that we've leaned into being ourselves with no fear of embarrassment. Because there's no way. I'm as adept on stage as Beyonce or Mick Jagger, but I'm definitely the best at being me right? And so that you can only kind of learn by doing and by loving.

Because it seems very important to you and the guys that everybody feel and be part of every moment.

So I forget what the question was, I'm so sorry.

Two groups of people.

We.

So we've been touring almost since then and we've learned from the. We call it the toilet circuit in England. Yeah, but I guess it's the bar circuit here would be the club circuit.

And even though I was at the Grammys the other day watching Bad Bunny Play and that hip-hop retrospective, which was amazing, yeah.

That's how I'm trying to navigate my life right now. One time this guy came up to me after the Brit Awards. He was really drunk. He said, What's it like? and I said, Hello, my good man.

You know, whether it's a McCartney or a Bono, or anyone Michael Stipe, any of those people.

One meal a day, and then you see it's this giant vat of beef chili.

Yeah, right now.

And we're very much ingrained to sort of think of them as from another planet. So if you didn't grow up around that, like you didn't or I didn't. Yeah, in some small part of you think, Oh, Tom, Cruise comes from another planet where everything's fine, yeah.

Of course, that's not true, but it's easy to fall back into that, sure, even when you're sitting with someone. For example, with Tom Cruise, who I love his work so much. The first time I met him, I didn't say anything about being a fan because I was like, he doesn't need to hear this.

Right? And then I realized, No, he's a human. So next time I was like, I love Bolivian or whatever it was. And so I have to do that thing as well with people. It doesn't have to be someone older.

It could be Adele or Harry Styles, or anyone that I think is great. Sometimes I might drift into that almost worshipful fan, treating them as a bit of an alien thing. Yeah, but then remember, Oh, this is a person and might even be my friend.

I was the host slash comic. We both do it our thing, and then we're sitting at this table together after we're done and Patty's with him. And at one point, we're just talking about music. And I just, This is going to lose me fans. But I inferred that I don't quite love the grateful dead as much as other people do.

It's not quite my thing. And um, Bruce, I hope this doesn't get him in trouble again. But Bruce was sort of was like, No, I kinda, I kinda know, you know, some some of it's great, but then there's some of it where I don't quite. And then Patty said, I love the grateful dead. What are you talking about? And then I could just see, like anyone else who's with their partner, Bruce, walking it back.

And Bruce was going. I did not mean to imply the grateful dead. And she was like, Well, I think they did amazing stuff, how could you say? And I was like, Again, I would like to stay.

I did not mean, and I was just so delighted that, oh right, when I put my foot in it with my wife. You know, this is what we deal with.

I breathe too much of this and that's yesterday that the strobes didn't go off at the right time. Complaints to anyone else in the world would just say, Go fuck yourself.

And you know, you do these world tours, you're waking up, you might not always know, or you might forget, Wait, where am I? Is this Madrid?

Is this Are we in Hawaii? where are we? And there's a whole production. What do you do to get yourself in the right space before you go out there and do a show?

In the same way that I could not go on stage dressed like this, I would not be able to do it. I have to put on my uniform, which looks pretty similar, looks pretty similar, but I know it's my band uniform, yeah.

And.

You're wearing sweats if there was an audience here. I sometimes, even if I put on a tie, even if it's not required, I just feel that I need to do something. That shows that. I'm an ice cream man and I put on my ice cream man uniform.

Which was a true and being really kind, but I was thinking about. I am happy to feel like I have to wear an outfit if it helps me perform better, but I don't agree with telling people what they have to wear. Maybe that's a hangover from school where you're told you have to wear this, or I was.

I was, I need to write a treatise on this, like the sort of clothing rules.

Or maybe maybe we're sort of brainwashed to thinking, if you're not wearing a tuxedo, you can't get married kind of thing, right? Of course, you can if you're hot, you know, what if you're an axe murderer and you're dressed correctly?

Are you a better groom than Woody Harrelson over here, who loves you with all his heart but is wearing board shorts? Right, right, right, no, you're not.

But I didn't know the answer.

Yeah, through just.

And a lot of them have names like Bash or Hoppy Mystic, things like that. And then he met this guy called Woody, and he started talking about, You know, what do you do to fold the cables? and it was Woody Harrelson.

Hello Woody.

And I said, Oh, you talked to Jim, and she was like, Yes, and I told him. If you want to be in comedy, you stick with it and they're going to try and put you down, but you keep. Of course, he had had like nine.

He was the biggest star in the world at the time. And I said, Mom, all I want you to do is go back to Boston and tell your friends you told Jim Carrey to stick with comedy.

And I was singing, not loudly, not like, Hey, check this out, yeah, but I was mumbling or something. And she said, Oh, you have a beautiful voice, and I said, Oh, thank you so much.

She said, You know, you should, you should do something with that. And I and I said, and I said, Oh well, maybe. And she said, also, you look like the guy from Coldplay. This is really true, and I said, Oh, yeah, people say that.

And she said, You know what you should do? You should call restaurants and say that you're him, because you would get really good tables, and then she left.

And it was amazing.

People say, oh, you look, you look like that person, but you're, you're dressed in a tracksuit. It can't be him.

That's right. We got to connect, which was nice, just as guys who are two dads who are at a kid's basketball game, that was fun.

But it's just nice, it's nice when it's part of their lives.

And it's to do with the frequency that that type of ear canal resonates with. Yeah, and then why? There are other singers that appeal to more people because they have a thicker bandwidth. It's really interesting.

Billie Eilish's brother, Phineas Phineas, Yeah, wears one on stage, because if you're on stage, it can give you help. You know where the one is, where the kick is.

So she had seen this lady use it in the hearing impaired deaf community, and she said, you should use this somehow. And so we started doing that and it's been so amazing and should get better and better. So we have. I don't know whether it's 10 or 20 now every night of those packs.

And so if you're hearing impaired, we have an area where we have a signer and you put on this pack and you can feel the show.

Right?

And he was 59 actually when we met him. Yeah, and he would always be learning and excited about learning. And I really just loved that and stole it.

And he'll get you for that, and I'm going to steal it now too.

But there is inspiration everywhere, not just in music, but in film and in everything science all over the place. And then you said about not having anything else to achieve. I think that whether it's a combination of what I try and learn outside of music, or whether it's age or whatever, it doesn't really feel about trying to achieve anything anymore. It just feels like Phil and I were talking yesterday. It feels like we got the job that we really wanted and now we can just do it.

Yeah, does that make sense?

It's not about winning this and beating that person anymore, it's like just make something that some people might like.

And one of the hardest ones is that, oh man, Harry Styles new song is better than our new song or something like that.

This was really a blast.

That's the power of soft rock.

Let's check in with the people, do a voicemail, all right, I like to hear from the peeps. Sona What?

You in on this, what are we doing? I'm sorry, wait, what did you say? what are we doing?

You were looking right at him as he spoke. It wasn't, no, I wasn't. I was. I had my hair was shedding, so I was taking the bits of my hair and then I was putting it in. But I actually know what we're talking about, putting it in, what the trash can.

You throw your hair in the trash, what else would? I don't want to throw it on the floor. It's part of you. Wait, you want me to. It's falling off, you're supposed to make a talisman out of it.

Yeah, and give it to people. Yeah, your great-grandmother would want you to make something out of it. Called like a watch it what called like a Rebbi-boop.

Yeah, why not make a rebbi-boop? Yeah, tie it all together and make a little rebbi-boop, man? Oh, I'm sorry. Okay, I'll start.

Here, here's one. Okay, well, that's the start of your rebbi-boop. What does the rebbi-boop do? Oh, please.

You don't know Armenian the way I do. I just want you to tell me what it does. It protects you in the night. It's like an evil eye, okay?

Okay, we're going to do a voicemail. Sound good, sure, let's hear it.

Sound good, yes.

Or you don't even mess with some kinds of socks. are you wool socked during the winter? like, what's your? I don't know just what's your sock game?

All right, take care.

Wow, I've never heard the podcast. Well, I want to call that out, because I think the only way to call in is if you listen to the podcast. So this person's yanking your chain, this guy's playing with my sock is what he's doing.

You know, I'm going to say, let's assume, let's take him at his word. He sounds very casual, unless he's trying super hard to be casual. He might be a huge fan who's laying it on thick. Like, I don't really listen to the broadcast, that means he's listened to everyone twice.

And some of them backwards. I don't know. I think he's really high. I think he's at home eating some doritos. And he's like, I'm going to call Conan O'Brien, and then he just googled how to call you.

I think that's true. Yeah, I'm going to go with that, all right. That seems like the most likely scenario.

What's his name? again? He didn't say, he didn't say a name. Wow.

He is pretty chill. Yeah, all right, I'm going to call him chill zone, chill zone.

Just for lack of a real name chill zone, that's a good question, is it? It isn't? I'm going to say that was muscle memory.

Chill zone. You've been busted on all fronts. Yeah, you are a rude stoner, which is a very odd combination. I've never listened to your podcast. Screw you man.

I'm so high. It's not usually how people come across when they're stoned, but anyway, I will reveal how I do it. I have two drawers, you do.

I do have two drawers. Man, what an aristocrat. Exactly that's the dream two sock drawers.

Hey, when I was a child, getting hand-me-downs from Luke and Neal that didn't fit. I dreamed of not one sock drawer of my own, but two one has all athletic socks. Because, as you know, Sona, I work out constantly gym rat, you don't just get a body like mine.

You have to be an accident. I was going to slam myself, but you didn't trust me to do it. Aww. And then I have one that is all purpose, like some wool socks, some of those gold toe socks classic.

That are still left over from my late night days. Wow. I never went out and bought gold toe socks, but that was the ones that were assigned to me. Like TBS, NBC, these socks go back thousands of years, so you stole them.

No, from the networks, you can't steal socks, they just end up being transferred from one place to the other. That's national broadcasting company property that you're....

You know, true story. All the suits I wore all those years at NBC, they were very careful about it. If I wore them on the weekend or something to an event, they would want that back on Monday. Oh, I used to kind of wonder about it because I'm 6'4 with very specific measurements, and I thought these suits aren't really going to fit anybody else.

I have legs that are.

My body is disproportionate, I'm a very large person. What are they going to be doing with these suits? And they told me extras wear them in scenes at Saturday Night Live.

You're kidding me, yep. Whenever you see a 6'4, really long-legged background person on an SNL sketch, they might be wearing a vintage Conan O'Brien suit from the 90s and 2000s. Actors were probably very nervous because they want to be actors, and they're just in the background, sweating all day and night in that thing, and then you're Monday morning.

Oh, no, they wouldn't give it during the show, it wasn't during, it was after I was done with them. When I had, you know, no, no. It wasn't like I had to turn them in so that on the weekend, a stranger could wear them in a sketch.

In my defense, I was only half listening. I have a question about your socks, yeah, do you fold them into each other or do you lay them flat to save the elasticity of them? Does that work?

I lay one on top of the other and then fold. Okay, yeah, that's how I do it too, but some people are very big on saving the elastic. I'm not, I just don't care.

If they get a little loose and floppy, it just makes me look like a real cool dude. It does, yeah, one floppy sock, yeah.

Every now and then I like to show a little ankle. You know, I'm very Victorian about my sexuality. Every now and then I want someone to just catch a little bit of my ankle and go. Ooh, I'm intrigued, oh, oh.

You know, there was a time when people showed a lot less and you had to use your imagination. In Victorian era, people used to say, like, Ooh, look at that upper collar bone. That's where the phrase put. Your best foot forward comes from, showing off your ankle and your calf. Oh, really, from the restoration days.

Yes, it does. Yeah, that's true, that's great, yeah.

I'm so sorry I didn't know how to react. In a culture where only your eyes are seen if you're completely covered except your eyes, people are like, Wow, showing a little lash today. Yeah, I mean, it can be taken to any extreme.

Yeah, yeah, I think we are losing our sense of true sensuality by showing too much. And I'm trying to bring it back by covering as much of my body as possible, and that's by popular request. You just wear a sheet where the hole of your wanger sticks out.

That sounds like a failed car from the late 70s. It's the Dunson Wanger.

Goes 35 miles per hour at top speed.

Where do you come up with these, your wanger? I don't know. I mean, that sounds fair, you know what?

You're a guy that talks dirty from like, 1952.

I know this guy was arrested on fifth and Elm for showing his wanger.

His straw hat has been confiscated and is being confined in a 1932 Nash Rambler, and Kelly apologizes.

I honestly don't know what's ever going to come out of your mouth. Why use a standard term when you can make a new one? You know what I mean? I thought that might be one that you use. Does anybody use?

Wanger wang is a term for todger. Oh, God.

Sometimes I think that, you know those romantic shows where a guy is traveling through time and he has a passionate love. In the present day. What's it called? Oh, are you talking?-?

I'm here with the old diddly squat. You guys are bringing these terms back, so that's cool, that's really cool. Yeah, it's, you know.

Well, I hope I do have. I don't popular again. Would you say that I'm an extravagant person? No, I would not at all. I'm not, but I do have two sock drawers and I think that answers the question. Listen, if you can have two sock drawers, I think everybody would want to be able to have two sock drawers.

Yeah, but because I have two, my son has no drawers at all. Oh, you had to take some of his? Yeah, we had to take some of his drawer space. So he has no socks, he doesn't wear socks, he can't.

He can't have socks. that's rough. Yeah, he can't have anything really. What socks are you wearing today? Uh....

Those are nice. Oh, I see black, black, that's sweet, just regular black wool socks, okay?

You know, that's all not a big deal anyway. Wow, you thought you were going to take us to a prom? No, I didn't.

Whoa, Oh, look hey, that's cool. Yeah, where's Waldo?

There's Waldo, what do you got? I just got ankle socks showing a little ankle, oh.

And Palsy.

Oh, let's wrap this up all right. Well, anyway. Hey, I hope you do get a chance to check out the podcast sometime.

How will he hear this? You? Laid-back slacker? Yeah, all right, did it.

Bye, bye, bye, Conan O'Brien needs a friend with Conan O'Brien, Sona Movsesian and Matt Gourley. Produced by Me Matt Gourley.

Executive produced by Adam Sachs, Joanna Solitaroff and Jeff Ross at Team Coco and Colin Anderson and Cody Fisher at Earwolf. Theme song by the White Stripes. Incidental music by Jimmy Vivino. Take it away, Jimmy.

Our supervising producer is Aaron Blair and our associate talent producer is Jennifer. Samples engineering by Eduardo Perez. Additional production support by Mars Melnick, Talent booking by Paula Davis, Gina Batista and Brit Kahn. You can rate and review this show on Apple Podcasts, and you might find your review read on a future episode.

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