"Steve Martin & Martin Short"

Hey, did you guys know your pupils are the last part to stop working when you die?

No. Is that correct?

Yeah, they dilate. Oh, that's incredible.

You know the last thing to go through a bug's mind before he hits your windshield?

What?

His asshole. Welcome to SmartLess.

I thought it is 200th celebration. You know what? It's a great day for us, and I gotta remember, I had a bit of an okay start, and then you have grumpy moments, and I just remember this thing, which is like, just because you have a grumpy start doesn't mean you can't have a great finish.

That's right. Look, we don't need a bumper sticker or anything right here, Will. Okay. What about you? just tell us what the problem is, and then we'll see how silly you are.

You look like, your current look with your beanies and your beard. look like you've got a million bumper stickers, and a lot of them say co-exist with different, on the back of.

your fucking outback. Does my beanie and my beard put you in a deeper bad mood than my? Sally Jessie Raphael glasses? You know why?

Because it puts you deeper into Vermont, okay, for me.

Yeah, yeah. No, it looks like you're from Seattle.

Oh God, if you could smell my patchouli right now. Hmm. Um, Willie. Willie, what's wrong? Will, yeah, yeah.

No, nothing. Nothing. I'm just, just, it's just been so much, it's just been a lot of admin, and admin stuff gets me pissed, and, and because, as you both know.

Domestic administration.

No, not domestic. Just work. admin, and I have a certain way. I like doing things, and then, when people fuck it up, I'm like, my patience for stuff is like, I go, I go, whew, fucking, what, you've, just, things got more, why didn't, why didn't stuff just go the way, you let me, I, my, I thought.

This is relatable complaints about having too much work? Is that what it is? Getting a lot of sympathy from the, um.

No, no, these are relatable things about, that everybody has with just life, when life gets away, and you just go like, ah, you know what I mean? I know.

Anyway. I know. Um, I get that way too. I get that way too, when people can't, like, get inside your head. I'll walk into a room, and I'll go, I don't know, I don't know why she said that, and Scotty goes, you have to catch me way up.

And you just assume that everybody's in your brain. Yeah.

And everybody's suited as you, all caught up.

Can't they just read your mind? Yeah.

That's right. Yeah. Anyway, this is wonderful. It is.

It's a great, what is this?

Yeah, this is supposed to be a day of celebration. Can you believe we've done 200 of these? Yes! 200 episodes!

I can't believe 200 episodes.

It's hard.

This is amazing.

Has it been, does that mean that it's been 200 weeks since we debuted?

Kind of.

Is it clean? math like that?

I think it's a pretty clean math. Once a week, yeah.

Does it feel like it's been 200?

It does not.

It does not. It feels like we've been doing it for two weeks.

It feels like two thousand, okay, yeah, two weeks, sorry. Two thousand, sorry. Two thousand, sorry.

So, the math is tough for me, but it does, that sort of correlates to what, four years?

Well, if it's one a week, right? Yeah.

That's 52 a year.

And we've done 200, right?

Yeah, it's four years.

It's 200 weeks. Right?

Yeah.

Do you want me to keep saying it right?

Is that not four years?

Well, 208.

Would it be four years? So, in two more months, it'll be four years.

Right?

So, like, we're less than smart. No, because 52 times four is 90, what? No. Oh, no.

You're really getting stumped on this.

Wait, what's? 52 times four? Oh, my God. Eight. Five times four.

What have I done? What have I done?

Yeah. It's 208, man!

Yeah, yeah.

So, we're not there yet, but soon it'll be four years.

So, not four years, but we're 200.

Jason, sorry, just real quick sidebar.

Oh, yeah. No, I've got them all standing up. I've turned them into little side tables.

Sure.

Yeah, it's quite a collection.

You don't have socks.

By the way, have we already discussed this? We don't need to get too blue, but I didn't know what the sock... I didn't know about the sock method until... I mean, I'm 54 years old. I didn't know about it until, like, two years ago.

Okay.

But that you use a sock instead of Kleenex or something?

Yeah. It's just genius. It's just...

I can't agree with you. Wait, I didn't know which way you were going with that. Honestly, Sean, didn't you think... I thought he was about to go, it's just disgusting knowing that.

I wish I could go back in time.

You can toss it in the wash.

Oh, I would have saved so much.

I mean, I guess for you, this is your answer to if you could turn back time, right?

If I could turn back time, my masturbation technique would just be so fantastic.

What a bird of a time machine use.

I was watching Oprah decades ago, and they did this piece.

Did she cover this?

She did. No, no, she didn't. And she did this piece on this college kid, and they took her whole crew there, and they went inside the college kid's dorm. And with no irony or joking around, they were interviewing this kid, and his roommates were like, yeah, and he's got this and this. And look, and they opened up his side drawer right next to his pillow, and there was tons of Kleenex in there.

He's always sick every night. Yeah.

And I was like sitting at home going, they actually believe that this kid gets sick.

Oh, bless it.

Well, he does. He doesn't get, but his dick barfs, you know?

Hey, now, Will.

That's an old school.

sneezes.

Shawnee, what's your mood like today on our 200?

I'm better now, by the way. I feel much better now that I'm subject to your faces. You just need a little sunshine from your buddies. I know, it's true.

I'm good. I'm getting my teeth cleaned later today, so I need to...

You're getting your teeth cleaned, so that's a joyous day for you.

It is. I like getting my teeth cleaned.

So what happens? You just FedEx him off, and then they return him a couple days later? How does that work?

You just click those out and put in the weekday set?

You just have a.

I'm waking up. I forgot to put them back in.

Oh, yeah.

Make sure to get your speech impediment for them. We're recording. You don't need to put those in. Just for an hour, keep them out.

No, I gotta leave them in all the time.

Abel was late getting in the car. This was this morning. Fucking teenagers. It was part of the thing. I got into this thing because the kids...

I love the way they fall back asleep.

They fall back asleep.

And I'm like, what are you doing? You're gonna be late for school.

You're gonna be late for school, and Uber is expensive. I'm trying to make them feel bad, and I'm like, you gotta get going. Abel goes inside, and I'm like, what's going on? I'm like, backing out. He comes running out, and I go, what did he say?

Are they dealing with the wax, too? They gotta put the wax over the hot spots?

Archie has to do it because Archie has the old school ones, and then Abe's got the invisalign. They get to choose.

Well, yeah. Mine's not called... Mine's the same thing, but they put those permanent things on the back of your teeth. Those little posts? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So is headgear no longer a thing? Is this the new headgear?

It can be. I'll still wear it.

It's still a thing, yeah.

You have headgear as well?

Oh, no, that's for a different thing. He's thinking of a different headgear, sorry. It's more like a ball that's attached to it. Sean, am I... I don't want to speak for you.

That's right.

That's right.

Is there a harness at all involved in this?

But it's fun. It's fun on the outside. It says Chicago Cubs. Like, he tries to make it kind of homey.

It's enough, because we got fancy guests. Let's go, let's go. So let's tighten it up. It's, you know, I figured, since it was the 200th episode and just happened to be my turn for a guest, I figured, you know, it was 200.. We need two guests, right?

Wait, we're to give Sean more math. You're killing it.

What's 100 times two?

And it's not just two guests. It is a duo. This is a duo that...

Captain Neal.

Well, very close. And it's not Sonny and Cher either, but we're getting closer.

Uh-oh.

Steve Martin and Martin Short. No!

Hey!

Guys, right? Now, what's the mood like now, Willie?

It's a little bit better. It's a little bit better.

Oh, this is wonderful.

Steve, hi, everyone.

Hi. It's too much.

First of all, I have to just jump in.

You gotta go?

Yeah, I gotta go. I gotta jump in and say how great it was to hear you guys try to figure out what 200 was. And the closest thing...

It is 4 times 50, right?

The closest thing I can come up with is that you think 200 is 208.

Well, you know, we're not trying to trick anyone into thinking we're smart. We put it right there in the title, you know? We're smart less. Yeah. Which makes me think...

No, I get it. Yep. Yes, yes, yes.

Oh, Marty finally gets it. Yeah.

But, you know.

And by the way, 4 times 52 is like a 85.

It's 80.

It's, um.

This is gonna hurt.

No, it's not gonna hurt. It's so obvious. Right. Like, we've been reviewed that way so many times, that we expect more from our audience.

Every day I get an email, hey, what about Steve Martin? short? And then I'd see it on any, you know, Twitter thing, I'm on. What about that?

Well, Marty should know that it's so obvious. it's also Jason's title of his memoir, so...

That's why.

It was taken.

No, we've had many different titles. One of my favorite was Two for the Price of Three.

Depending on your seat. But what about... These titles. An Evening You Will Forget for the Rest of Your Life. Genius.

It's two years old, but.

Is it? Why do they say new? You know, Wikipedia, it's just not what it used to be.

Yeah, really. No, I know.

Also, your dreams are not as informative as these were.

Marty, do you have excellent lighting or is that new work?

You know what?

Have you ever heard of the word combo?

Marty.

You must admit, I look.

The great thing about Marty is he has it all done at once.

Right.

The hair, the eyes, the nose, the teeth.

It's true.

And you heal all at once. You heal, it's six weeks and it's over.

Well, you know, I didn't get much from that book about Liberace, but I got a few pointers.

I would say that the last time I saw Marty was at the opening of Sean, Your Play. And I was walking, I think I told this, and I was walking by the bar to go upstairs and he was like 50 people away from me and he yelled across everybody, why can't you have talent like that?

I have to add a line from your earlier conversation about Kleenex, because Lenny Bruce had a line. It's like the mother and she goes in her son's, you know, room and picks up. She goes, oh, oh, look, Sonny blew his nose on the Playboy magazine again.

Oh, is that funny?

Wait a minute. You know, guys, you know, Selena was on. Selena Gomez was on our show a while ago and she said, Steve, she brought you up and she said that, you know, I always wonder if we're going to keep doing more seasons and Steve says, I want to do the show. We're standing on the set and Steve goes, I want to do this show forever. When do we get out of here today?

First of all, we pay our compliments to Selena. She's lovely to work with.

We love Selena.

And, you know, she doesn't mind us. Oh, that's Marty.

Does he need to get the door?

You're such a pro.

You know what? This is going to ring ten times. Because it's like having a little...

But it's a good location for your audio stuff. You know what?

We should have removed it.

Uh-huh. Is there a little cuckoo bird that's going to come out at the end? No, no, no.

But keep talking. But just remember, it's not nine o'clock. It's ten.

So this incredible duo started with the three amigos, yes? Yes. Is Wikipedia correct on that?

Correct.

Yes. Mostly correct.

Now, were you aware of each other at all beforehand? Who was in a better position career-wise at that point?

Well, Steve was, remember, a major star. Yes. And I was still in the ninth grade. Wait, wait, wait.

Did you say was? Yeah.

Wow. You've still got room to go back. Still rolling, Marty. Yeah.

Wow.

No, Steve, as you know, is a big, big star. There you go. And... But even then... No, I remember being aware of Steve.

Wait a second. Lorne Michaels was the host on camera?

No, no, no. He was executive producer.

Yes. Steve was the host. Gotcha.

And so Catherine O'Hara was also on the show, and we were friends with Catherine, so Nancy and I went and visited Catherine. Steve came into his dressing room doing quick change and was very friendly in that kind of icy way. that is so, Steve.

It was friendly. as far as I can go. Yeah.

You maxed out.

But I first met Marty at my house, and he came over to get a copy of the script for Three Amigos. Really? That's when I first met him. And I, of course, knew who he was, and I loved... Since then, you know, I learned more, because I always enjoyed him, but I also watched him do specials and create new characters, and I realized that his characters are so bizarre.

Well, thank you.

Right, it's like human behavior done by somebody who's never seen humans behave.

Exactly.

Right.

So was that part of the thinking, Steve? Was it, you know, this is a fella that, mixed in with what I'm doing and what John would be doing, that it would be a great third element, creating a sort of red, blue, green?

Here's exactly what I thought. I gave Marty the script, and I said, now, look, when you read this script and you come across Rick Moranis' name, just cross it out and write yours in.

Unavailable.

No, no, I was definitely the cheap amigo. I was the, you know, Carrot Top had said, let me think about it.

Wait, what about, and then Chevy was what?

Well, no, it was going to be Steve and Chevy. They were the, I think the original, wasn't it, John Candy?

I think it was John Belushi.

Yeah. Oh, wow.

I think it was John Belushi,

And then Chevy was last?

No, Chevy was in. Okay. Me and Chevy were definitely in.

It's actually Chevy and I, but whatever.

Marty, what was that? Speaking of doing your, you know, when Steve was talking about characters, I never knew, like, obviously I was such a huge fan of SNL then and now, but your character, Jackie, somebody with the blonde or the white wig.

Jackie Rogers Jr.

Jackie Rogers Jr. I've never known who that is or was, and I just, I only have.

I'll tell you exactly who he was. I had done a piece.

An alien?

No, a piece on SCTV called the idea that Jackie Rogers Sr. had been killed shooting a special called Old Mother Nature, She Loves Me, and he was attacked by a cougar and killed, and it had been on the show for 11 years, and then they were going to air it. But at the end, I needed someone to pop on and say, I miss my dad, I hope you won't. Thursdays at 7, and I'd seen a picture of Mickey Rooney Jr. who looked albino, so I made him albino.

Okay, got it. So wait, Jackie Rogers Jr.

I love that you have a character backstory, like you're Marlon Brando.

I'm really funny.

Uncle Soul Cigar.

What was the name of the Mother Nature one?

Old Mother Nature, She Loves Me.

Was killed by a rogue cougar.

Yeah, there'd be a scene with me singing to a squirrel, pardon me, Miss, but I never done this with a real live squirrel. But then you saw a cougar lurking, and he attacked me and killed me.

Marty, tell them the title of your TV special that I love so much.

I, Martin Short Goes Hollywood.

But that reminded me of something I read years ago, of this funniest book title I ever read, and then I thought, oh, I wish I had thought of that, and then I researched it, and there is no book called that, and I thought, maybe I did think of it, but it was kind of a comedy biography of a fictitious actor called I, a Actor.

I, a Actor?

I, a Actor.

And we will be right back.

And now, back to the show.

Was it clear to you guys, doing that first project, that there was going to be a long life to this friendship and this work collaboration, or did that just kind of grow on its own?

No, I mean, I think it happens when you're working together. I mean, sometimes, as we all know, you do, you know, you're in Romania with a group of people for three months and you make a film, and then you never, ever see them again. But with Steve, I thought, no, I want to keep this going. You know, I want to, I want to. So we would do amigo at dinners, and go ahead.

Can you see me raising my hand? Yeah, go for Steve. No, I was just saying that, you know, you're right. You usually work with somebody, then you never see them again, but in this case, we continued to work together, kind of coincidentally, through Father of the Bride movies, and did we do another movie together?

Yeah, we did, but that's not, I think the point of it is.

Father of the Bride, too.

Oh, yeah, you're right, yeah, yeah.

And the scenes that were cut from Schindler's.

No.

That you were not supposed to talk about, Marty. You know you're not supposed to mention it.

Just tonally, tonally, it was not,

it was a swing.

No, no, no, but Steve, Steve, Father of the Bride, was five years after Three Amigos. We continued to be great friends when we were together, yeah.

Well, it's like you guys, you're constantly riffing off each other. It's fun, and when you work together, you start doing that all the time, and then you develop a kind of a, not only a kinship, but a style.

And you guys had, and you guys also, right, you have a style, and you have, socially, you have a lot of friends, right, in common, so you're sort of in the same circles. You're kind of in each other's orbits and on a lot of levels, right?

Well, let me add something. Only Marty has friends.

That's my problem with these two.

I benefit from his friends.

Yeah, yeah. That's not true.

But he's very social. Everybody wants to be with Marty, and I've told this before. I'd say, you know, if we're, for example, or someone is plotting a dinner party in Hollywood, and you invite these people, and you invite Marty, and if Marty can't come, you cancel the party. Yeah, yeah. Because everyone else is going to fall off.

The Marty party. The Marty party. But back then, and certainly after the success of Three Amigos, you guys could have, if you wanted, to, start to generate your own sort of two-hander kind of vehicles, you know, much like you guys are doing today with your live stuff. That didn't really, did you think about it? Did that start?

No, you know, Steve was a massive movie star, and I was just kind of there, you know? So he was, while he was doing Roxanne, I was, you know, doing the love boat reunion or something, so it wasn't always equal. And I think it was, as Steve said, it just so happened that we were both cast.

So that was the impetus for this whole other thing that you guys had created. Yes, right.

But I have to add something, and Jason said, after the success of Three Amigos, dot, dot, dot, you really mean 20 years after the success, the Three Amigos, did it become a success? It was a minor success at the time, and then it had an accumulation, at a crude value. And then I remember, 10 years ago, a magazine from the UK, I think it was called Empire Magazine, they called, we want to put you, Chevy, and Marty on the cover. And I said, why? And they said, well, it's the 25th anniversary of Three Amigos.

And it's a huge hit.

And I go, you mean, somebody cares? I didn't think anybody even ever thought about it.

Wow.

Yeah, but the next year they did the cover, 25 years later, from Ishtar.

It's a magazine of flops. Yeah, I see now.

Now, for a couple of fellas that usually, with your level of success, want to do, the last thing they want to do is start bopping around the country on the frequency that you guys are, staying in hotels, going up live every night, it's a big thing that you guys are doing all the time, to massive success, and you could probably do a million more shows.

When you put it that way, geez.

But I mean, I just think it's just incredible that you guys are, is it getting, is it tiring? Are you sorry that you've got so much momentum built up with this, and all the fans that you would disappoint if you stopped? I mean, you're screwed now.

Well, the truth is,

You should get yourself a nice sitcom, you know? You get six hours a day, and you're just, you know, down the street.

Well, I mean, that's a good idea.

No, you know, it seems like way more work than it is. It really is, because we'll do maybe four shows, and then we won't do it again for two weeks.

Right, right.

And they are fun, and then we, I mean, Steve and I will then, you know, have a glass of wine afterwards and discuss the show, and everyone kind of loves each other, because we have the Steep Canyon Rangers, and we have Jeff Babco, my piano guy, and everyone, and the stage manager, it's all become very close, so it's fun.

Yeah.

There are no pricks allowed.

Our max is six, maybe seven shows a month. Okay. So it's not, you know, I couldn't do it, because I got a family,

and I love being home, you know? No, me too.

Steve, is it true, years and years ago, Steve, that you, I've always heard this, I've never had the fortunate opportunity to have one, but did you used to have cards made? when people came up to you, asked for a photo or an autograph, and you would just hand them a card? that said, you've met Steve Martin?

I thought it was funny. This is in the 70s, when I was getting asked for a lot of autographs, and so I made up a card, and it said, because I thought, what do people really want when they get an autograph? They want to say that they met you, that's the main thing, and what was he like?

Yeah.

In, you know, like the 12 seconds that they met you, what was he like? So I wrote, this certifies that you met me and found me warm, charming, intelligent, and funny, and then I had a printed signature on it, and then I found I'd give the cards out, thinking it was hilarious, and then they'd say, could you sign this?

No way.

Yeah, so I said, well, that's over.

Oh, wow.

This, when you guys come together and you think up another show, because how many of the live tours have you guys done? It's four, five, six?

Well, you mean different titles? Yes. I mean, but we keep changing the material all the time. We always...

Well, in fairness, we, it's slowly evolving. We don't, we? never throw everything out and then bring everything new in. It would be impossible. So it just slowly evolves.

Yeah, like, what is that process like? Would it be like what the process would be, I'm assuming, for stand-up, where you've got to spend a bunch of weeks or months accruing brand new material, observations, jokes, et cetera, and shape that into a set that you like? Is that the same process you guys go through, or no? You're saying it's sort of the same core and then you just kind of update it, yeah?

Yeah, we change things one line at a time, and then, every once in a while, we'll come up with a new idea and we'll put it in whole.

And is there a formal process when you guys will get together and write, or you do it via Zoom, where you just sit there?

Zoom, we'll do Zoom.

Yeah, we'll do Zoom, and we'll have a bunch of material in front of us, but, you know, we'll do that at the beginning of a tour if we have a lot of new material to go over.

Would you guys consider doing, like, Google Spaces or Microsoft Teams?

Oh, we've done that.

I don't want to fuck with your process, your creative process, I'm just saying.

Now, Marty, is it true, Marty, that you originally saw yourself more as a singer and an actor, and if so, at what point did you feel it was a safe pivot to go into straight-up comedy, screw the singing, screw the. I'm not going to be a character?

And do you regret it? And do you?

And what were you thinking? No, I think it wasn't until I joined Second City in Toronto that I started to develop characters and realized that I could improvise and all that stuff. But up until then, I thought I wanted to be Sinatra. Frank Jr., oddly enough, not the father.

And I wanted to.

And I used to, you know, I used to do musicals and I would do plays.

But I'm sure you must have been, you must have had some comedic success in high school, right? Junior high?

Well, no, no, I was funny in the class.

I heard you killed in St. Catharines. I heard that you would kill in Hamilton in St. Catharines. Is that true?

Oh, yeah, you know, at the Hungry Lion in Hamilton. No, I grew up in a very funny family. My brother, Michael, has won many Emmys and awards, writing everything from SCTV to Schitt's Creek. So he was the eldest. And it was a very funny family.

And, as you know, Marty is an incredible singer. I mean, I listen to him on stage every night. He's never flat, he's never sharp. And, curiously, he's never on the note.

But.

But, no, he's incredible. He never misses. He has a beautiful tone.

Is he a better singer than you? are a banjo player?

Absolutely.

Is he?

That's high praise, because you know what you're doing on that thing, right?

Well, oh, Steve's good.

I do in a way.

There could be some Grammys there.

In fact, whenever Steve plays the banjo.

I've won Grammys playing the banjo.

You've won many Grammys, Steve, haven't you?

Playing the banjo, yeah.

Whenever Steve plays the banjo, I like to just close my eyes and pretend I'm on hold with Cracker Barrel.

Do you guys do a bit of a singing-slash-banjo-playing piece in the live shows?

We don't actually sing and play together. We do some songs, but we use piano and we use our orchestra. But we don't have a banjo number.

Jason, have you not seen it?

No, I've never been invited.

It's so good. It's so funny and so hysterical.

What, the show? I haven't seen it either. I've been busy. In my defense, I'm very busy. Yeah, I know.

You've mentioned it. I listen to Smartless all the time, and I always hear, you've said many times, I'm busy.

I'm very busy.

I'm just not sure at what. Yeah, busy.

In what country.

Wait, wait.

Steve, I want to ask you. Actually, you mentioned Grammys, and you've won Grammys for your banjo playing, but you've also won many Grammys for stand-up over the years. And do you, I don't know if you do any stand-up anymore at all, ever?

The only stand-up I do is in our show. Yeah. I call it stand-up with Marty, but we each have a section in our show, and I just sort of do monologue jokes and introduce a song on the banjo and play it. But I love doing it. And it took me as long, as much time to work out that 10 minutes as it used to take to work out 10 minutes.

Is there, what is the oldest joke that you still include in your set? Like the one that just never fails. It goes all the way back to Carson, perhaps. Oh. Appearance is there.

I don't. No. I mean, there's jokes that, you know, for example, when we did our Netflix special, then we really started trying to change things out. And then, three years later, we're talking, we're going, you know what I miss? That one joke.

Marty, you're famous for really loving, preparing very deeply for talk show appearances.

I thought you were going to say, Marty, you're famous for using the same old joke.

Which one is your favorite?

Which one of the three? How is it to deeply prepare using old material?

But you enjoy, did I hear this right, that you enjoy preparing for talk show appearances, whereas some of us love-?

Well, I just have a philosophy about it. I mean, I just kind of, I mean, it's like, it's work, and you've got to prepare. I just don't want to go out and fail and feel it was my fault. So if I send in, you know, 15 pages, and then I go out with Kimmel or Letterman or Fallon, whoever, and they're off, or I'm a little off, but if I go out gunning for bear, I feel like whatever happens, I can still toast myself, because I did everything I could do.

I feel the exact same way. How is it going today for you? Did you prepare today?

I did, and none of it is working.

You should toast yourself, because you did your best. You should toast yourself.

You know what, I should. I should. I mean, I got the lighting.

Again, to sort of the portion of the interview, hashtag relatable, talking about talk show appearances, I find that I get, I start to feel sad, and like I'm losing my soul as I start to, like, the two weeks before the talk show appearance, I start to really try to log things in my life. Oh, this would be good to talk about, or this would be good, and they're like deeply personal, cute moments, like with your children or whatever, and you think, well, fuck, why am I logging this for a talk show? I should be really frustrated.

Yeah, but it all works out, Jason.

I should save this for a movie. I should save it for a TV show.

No, no, but it works out, because, you know, really, you're working, you're working, you're feeling, you're losing your soul, you feel sad and depressed, and then, when you do it, that's what the audience feels, so it's a full journey.

You transferred to the audience.

Yes.

I'm not sure what you mean. You mean you feel like you're giving away your private life to do a talk show anecdote?

No, I feel like I should be more present in my moment with my children or whatever, instead of thinking, oh, this is funny what she's doing. I'm going to talk to Kimmel about this. Like, that's just...

No, you're doing the right thing. I'm doing the right thing. You're doing the right thing.

It's interesting, Marty, we've talked about this before, where people don't realize those kinds of on-camera interviews on those talk shows are kind of performances, and it's like we've all seen them and all witnessed them, so we know what the good ones look like, every single person in show business. So don't you want to do a good one?

The first talk show I ever did was in 1982, on Letterman, and I kept thinking, like the same thing. you're saying, Jason, what do I talk about? What do I think about? And then I realized, oh, I get it. You've got to...

Yeah, you know. what I can't stand, though, is when people go on who are funny, like considered funny people in the business, and they just like to talk about something serious, and people at home are judging them, and they go, oh, I saw them on Letterman or Fallon or whatever, or Kimmel. They're not that funny. They're not that funny. Yet a dramatic actor goes on and says one funny thing.

I used to really resent having to.

We're so bitter.

Yeah.

I know.

When I was young and dumb and really super-duper full of myself, I used to think, oh, I'm going on this talk show. They're lucky to have me. I don't have to prepare anything. Fuck that. And they're not paying me to write.

But all the hosts vary. Some of them go right off. But when I would do Letterman, I swear he would hit one quarter of what I'd prepared. One time he said, tell the Tony Randall story. And I said, I was on two months ago and told the Tony Randall story, Dave.

I have a secret fantasy, which is to go on a talk show totally unprepared and just to see what happens.

But you could do that. And there are certain hosts that could definitely do that and not need them. Because sometimes the notes are really almost there more for them.

I want to talk about Only Murders. First of all, we share a mutual friend, John Hoffman, who I love.

And then he stabs you in the back.

Did you guys know when you were developing it together, I hate that question, did you know it was going to work? But did you have a sense that with the writing and you guys and the first table reads and the first kind of days of shooting, like, yeah, we have something here? Or were you still kind of unsure until the season was wrapped?

Didn't know a thing. Didn't know a thing. You just write it according to the premise. And then, when it started to hit the air and you started to get back word that, by the way, it's the biggest debut ever and that sort of thing. I don't know how accurate that is.

Yeah. Right.

Yeah.

We'll be right back.

And back to the show.

Now, there's word that you guys are going to be going to Los Angeles with it. Is the whole show switching to Los Angeles or no?

Well, that's one of those news stories, because we're shooting two days in Los Angeles. Ah. That it's mistaken, for, they're moving to the entire season, you know.

No, it's just, it's like a location shoot.

A gotcha. But it is shot in New York. Right. Yes. Do you both live in New York?

Steve lives in New York. I rent in New York.

But you, no, you rent while we're shooting. You don't live in New York. That is correct.

That is correct, sir.

Would you guys like for it to be shot in Los Angeles 100% of the time?

That was my, you know, when I had the idea for the show, I pitched it to them, to the producers, Dan Fogelman and Jess Rosenthal, based on, I wasn't even in it. I said, I think this is a good idea. And we liked it. Then they called me and said, would you do it? And I said, well, I can't.

Well, I mean, that's the thing. It's great that it's shot in New York. It feels 100% like a New York show.

And you just added Molly Shannon, I read.

Molly Shannon, yes.

That's super fun.

You have a great cast of people on that show.

So fantastic. Yeah. And that's what, when we get somebody that we can, like. we worked with Matthew Broderick. It was like so easy.

Yeah, Matthew's great. I love him.

But talk about an out-of-the-box piece of casting with Selena Gomez just obviously seems incredibly genius now. But, like the two of you with her, is so unexpected. How did that come about?

It came about after the fact. Because I had originally pitched it as three older people who have a lot of time on their hands. And, you know.

We were busy.

And then I think the studio suggested, what about Selena? actually? What about Selena? And we met her on Zoom. They actually cast her.

Wow. She's so sweet.

Well, I still wasn't sure. I was saying, okay, maybe a female. But what about Kathy Lee Gifford?

She's a local hire.

You've always been a champion of her.

You pull out names from an old hat.

From the Harry Potter sorting hat.

Now, talk about another thing that you would think would be unexpected. Steve, you've lived a very private life. It's very cool, very mysterious. I love that about you. You don't seek attention.

Yes, Morgan Neville.

I'm so glad.

What's it called?

It's called Steve, exclamation point.

Okay. Yeah, Steve, exclamation point. And I got a call from Morgan Neville about this documentary. And his credits are Won't You Be My Neighbor? And 20 Feet From Stardom.

Yeah.

He did a thing called Cool School.

Like an old sock.

A photo.

Pardon me.

A photo of an old sock. He kept the photo, not the sock.

I love, too, that you didn't know you had archives. You were just like, who was saving them?

It was a cherished sock. Anyway, they found a photo of my father in Germany in 1943 doing a USO show.

Oh, thank God. That could have gone a different direction. That could have gone a different direction.

I did not archive. I saved things. And I realized later, I would take things like, oh, I'm on a magazine cover. I'll save it. And I'd throw it in a thing.

Do you remember her name, though?

It was like archaeological, because as it went down, you would go past time, go through time.

Speaking about receipts, when Marty's biography came out, he didn't send me one. So I went to the bookstore, bought it, and, while I was at the cash register, put the book and the receipt, took a photo of it, emailed him, and said, that's okay, I got it.

Very good.

By the way, you can buy Marty's book on Amazon. I mean, you won't. Right.

If you needed it, it's there. Marty, what about a documentary biography? for you? Can't make his deal.

No, there's going to be one.

Oh, really?

Lawrence Kasdan, the legendary director, is doing it for Imagine.

Really? Wow.

Great. Have you been shooting it?

No, no, no. They're just, again, accumulating stuff.

Yeah, well, that's going to take years.

They're making the final decision on who it's about.

They're trying to decide the ending.

Yeah. How long are you in town, Marty?

I go to New York in about two weeks before we start shooting.

All right. Are you in the middle of production?

We don't start shooting for two weeks.

Yeah.

A new season, I mean? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

We'll shoot a couple days in L.

Okay, got it.

And how are you guys enjoying the process of being locked onto a show that lasts, I mean, how long is your season to shoot? Four, five, six months? Yeah, four.

It's about four months, and I actually love it. You know, the studio's 20 minutes from my house, and also you're working with two other co-stars, and so you're not shooting every day. And when we work together, it's really fun.

Yeah. And I would say that it is definitely Steve's philosophy, my philosophy, and it turned out, luckily, Selena's philosophy, to make the set as much fun and joyful as it can be. So there are no pricks allowed, and so it's fun to go to work.

It's just stunning how people don't enforce that rule commonly on a set, because the hours that you work, the cast and the crew, are often many more hours than you spend with your family. So why would you tolerate anything short of a family dynamic on a set?

J.

I've said this on the podcast before, but any job I get the very first day, say out loud to everybody, is if you look around and you can't find out who the asshole is, it's probably you.

Yeah, it's true.

Well, you guys have been very, very nice to help us celebrate our 200th. I mean, this is a very significant booking.

Honestly, what a thrill. If we added up our ages, it'd probably be around that.

What a thrill. Yeah.